Author Topic: Flow Frames could make beekeeping Profitable Again.  (Read 461 times)

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Offline apisbees

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Flow Frames could make beekeeping Profitable Again.
« on: November 28, 2017, 07:07:25 pm »
Knock off flow frames are cheaper than conventional Lanstroth honey supers.
Using conventional supers for honey you need 2 or more and need to pull them and extract them to put back on to give the bees the space that they need. lets add up the cost, 2 deep supers with frames, foundation
super $18.00, 10 frames $14.00, foundation 15.00, = $47.00 X 2 supers = $ 94.00. For the bees to draw out the 2 supers of comb will cause them to make 4lbs of wax. With 10 lbs of honey needed for the bees to produce a pound of wax, we have 40lbs of honey invested in the drawing out of the frames in 2 supers. With the value of honey at $5.00 a pound, the cost to the beekeeper for 2 deep honey supers is $294.00.
Buy the flow frames and modify a $18.00 super, run off the honey as the bees fill the frames giving them the additional room for storage. Starting out in bees do the math, forget the extractor, start harvesting more honey earlier with less investment. It sounds like a winning strategy to me, greater returns for less investments. Flow frames could make beekeeping profitable again.
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Offline Robo

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Re: Flow Frames could make beekeeping Profitable Again.
« Reply #1 on: November 28, 2017, 10:52:00 pm »
If only things worked out as well as they looked on paper :P
"Opportunity is missed by most people because it comes dressed in overalls and looks like work." - Thomas Edison


Offline apisbees

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Re: Flow Frames could make beekeeping Profitable Again.
« Reply #2 on: November 29, 2017, 01:51:26 am »
With the originally set price I wasn't surprised that the Chinese came out with a Knock off of them. But the amount the price has dropped and the speed it has on them is shocking.
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Online Lburou

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Re: Flow Frames could make beekeeping Profitable Again.
« Reply #3 on: November 29, 2017, 06:01:48 pm »
Apis, I would like to see the flow hive design be successful.

Your math solution is built on the premise that the flow frames actually work...have you seen them work?  I've read on the flow hive forums about queens laying in the flow frames, (the cells are supposed to be so deep that queens won't lay in them).  There have been other issues that I'm not up on, but it would really be something to go to the hive and pour the crop into a container without the extracting process.    :yes:
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Offline neillsayers

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Re: Flow Frames could make beekeeping Profitable Again.
« Reply #4 on: November 29, 2017, 07:07:43 pm »
There have been other issues that I'm not up on, but it would really be something to go to the hive and pour the crop into a container without the extracting process.    :yes:

Wouldn't that set up a robbing frenzy?
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Online Lburou

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Re: Flow Frames could make beekeeping Profitable Again.
« Reply #5 on: November 29, 2017, 09:35:41 pm »
Quote

Wouldn't that set up a robbing frenzy?
It would at my house.  :)
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Offline apisbees

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Re: Flow Frames could make beekeeping Profitable Again.
« Reply #6 on: November 30, 2017, 05:53:31 am »
I have seen them work.  John is giving me one this spring to use and play with. John is the guy from BC that had a testimonial on the first video before the crowd funding campaign began. If you buy the complete flow hive it comes with a queen excluder.  The cell size is drone brood size so you will not get worker brood but she will lay drones. like in any hive you need a surplus population of older worker bees that are nectar gatherers, to achieve this swarming must be kept under control. Pulling bees from a hive to control swarming is counter productive to having a hive with the maximum population for nectar gathering when the honey flow arrives.
My strategy for the flow hive this coming year is single deep brood box, queen excluder, flow super, and use the Demorie method of swarm control using a split Snelgrove board with a split super to raise 2 queen up on top. Basically taking 2 nucs from a hive but with out removing the bees from the hive.
Robbing is a condition of manipulation on a hive when there is a poor to no nectar flow. Draining frames while the flow is on the bees will be to buzzy to care. During a dearth using a hose and have it enter a container with a lid or saran-wrap will keep robbing from getting started.
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Online Lburou

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Re: Flow Frames could make beekeeping Profitable Again.
« Reply #7 on: November 30, 2017, 09:44:06 am »
...My strategy for the flow hive this coming year is single deep brood box, queen excluder, flow super, and use the Demorie method of swarm control using a split Snelgrove board with a split super to raise 2 queen up on top....
We will be interested to hear about your flow hive/frame experience Apis.  :)
Lee_Burough

Offline neillsayers

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Re: Flow Frames could make beekeeping Profitable Again.
« Reply #8 on: November 30, 2017, 10:49:26 am »
Tuned in! :)
Neill Sayers
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Offline Zweefer

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Re: Flow Frames could make beekeeping Profitable Again.
« Reply #9 on: January 06, 2018, 09:15:27 pm »
Late to the party, but also marked to follow...


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Offline Bakersdozen

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Re: Flow Frames could make beekeeping Profitable Again.
« Reply #10 on: January 07, 2018, 11:49:46 am »
I just saw this thread too.
Last fall I met a man with 2 colonies, who had two little kids.  He told me that on top of his brood boxes he put flow hives.  The flow hives were his honey supers.  No extractor needed, no hot knife, and no mess.  He was happy with the results.  My initial reaction was to poo poo it.  I thought about his situation and it made sense to me.  With two small children, it could be quite the mess to try to extract.  He invited me to come look at his set up, but I believe I have lost his phone number.

Offline tedh

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Re: Flow Frames could make beekeeping Profitable Again.
« Reply #11 on: January 07, 2018, 02:24:08 pm »
A friend of mine has a flow hive.  He harvested last summer, said it took a long time and made the bees a bit aggressive, probably from the exposed honey next to the hive.  He thought there might have been some "wild" bees/robbing involved.  Ted
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Offline apisbees

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Re: Flow Frames could make beekeeping Profitable Again.
« Reply #12 on: January 07, 2018, 03:14:58 pm »
Yes a little bit of plastic tubing and plastic wrap or a lid with a hole to fit tight around the lid would make a big different. Or go out after dark when the bees have stopped flying for the night.
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Offline brooksbeefarm

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Re: Flow Frames could make beekeeping Profitable Again.
« Reply #13 on: January 07, 2018, 05:05:55 pm »
I'm thinking (and that hurts :yes:) The honey would not be cured enough? and if it is, it would have that awful plastic taste to it from running through all that plastic. Perry will be jumping with joy working with all that plastic. :laugh:. Jack

Offline apisbees

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Re: Flow Frames could make beekeeping Profitable Again.
« Reply #14 on: January 07, 2018, 05:17:14 pm »
You would be supersized how good the honey looks right out of the frame. it is extremely bright as it has very few air bubbles in it and any it does are larger 1/8" in diameter so they rise and pop on the surface readily. You may get a couple of wax flakes but for the most part it is very clean. Jack, I think you need to try one to truly get the full appreciation for it.
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Offline LazyBkpr

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Re: Flow Frames could make beekeeping Profitable Again.
« Reply #15 on: January 07, 2018, 08:28:24 pm »
Jack, I think you need to try one to truly get the full appreciation for it.

   Aye! Are we going to take up a donation so we can collectively send Jack some plastic?    :laugh:
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Offline brooksbeefarm

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Re: Flow Frames could make beekeeping Profitable Again.
« Reply #16 on: January 07, 2018, 09:57:58 pm »
 :P :P :P Jack

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Re: Flow Frames could make beekeeping Profitable Again.
« Reply #17 on: February 22, 2018, 06:43:19 pm »
keith........
i am with robo on the flow hives......

"If only things worked out as well as they looked on paper :P"

also, some folks who have never kept bees and bought into the flow hives thought they could assemble this, put it out in their yard and garden and magically get honey. i have spoken to several and the disappointment and investment made them not very happy.  sad.

you are a well seasoned beekeeper, many of us are, and even those who are in the learning stages, have learned or know there is more to keeping bees and gathering honey...and the management involved.

i will stick to langstroths. i wish you well keith! you of all, would be able to successfully manage a flow hive!

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Offline apisbees

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Re: Flow Frames could make beekeeping Profitable Again.
« Reply #18 on: February 24, 2018, 02:50:41 am »
That is the problem with the marketing of the system. It is not a flow hive but only a flow frames in a flow super. The Colony is just a standard hive, that needs to be ran like any other hive for 47 months of the year, Maybe more. At the Flow people price they are a great novelty item, at the Chinese knock off price they almost makes sense. If managed properly the less equipment needed, the value of honey used by the bees in wax production to draw out foundation and the cost of extraction equipment. You could get away with less lifting of heave supers, less sticky mess in the house, very little cleanup, little wax moth and hive beetle damage. I do think it is gimmick beekeeping but not a totally bad gimmick.
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