Worldwide Beekeeping
Beekeeping => Pests and Diseases => Topic started by: tedh on July 20, 2014, 01:14:12 pm
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Hi Everyone,
Yesterday morning I saw a bee leave the hive carrying another bee. The bee being carried was dropped in the grass a few yards from the hive. I looked but didn't find the dropped bee. Today I saw a bee leaving the hive carrying yet another bee. This bee was dropped on the cement in front of the hive. I inspected the dropped bee and am concerned.
I will say that I hadn't noticed any problem bees (sick or unnatural looking) in the hive on my last inspection. It wasn't a deep inspection as I was hoping to start leaving them alone for 2 week stretches and just wanted to remove the entrance reducer. The bees SEEM to be happy and healthy, coming and going in a good steady stream. What with my untrained eye and limited knowledge I'd sure appreciate your thoughts. Ted
(https://worldwidebeekeeping.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fs12.postimg.cc%2Fp3r09zejt%2FIMG_20140720_110254_828.jpg&hash=9a24bebc807b2eefb6379f401d528f1a0a92ec29) (http://postimg.cc/image/p3r09zejt/)
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Hi Ted, it's too hard to tell by your pic. As I enlarge your pic to see a very tiny wing, it became blurry. But here is a pic of what deformed wing virus looks like. My hive was showing signs of dwv last fall, I was told to do a mite check. Turned out I had over 2,000 mites in my hive, and some pretty sick bees. If it is mites and dwv, better get on it Now!
(https://worldwidebeekeeping.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fs15.postimg.cc%2Fm44xvy9ef%2Fdeformed_wing_disease_from_mites.jpg&hash=8540181ec20c3e10bc9c5b9835196e72f9b82f00) (http://postimg.cc/image/m44xvy9ef/)
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Oh Good, that's much better. Well, if you ask me That is Deformed Wing Virus. Have you done a check for mites yet Ted?
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Hi Jen,
No I haven't checked for mites yet. I had the impression I wouldn't need to worry about that this year as they were/are new package bees? How did you go about checking for mites? I've read powder sugar shake method, method using alcohol, and a method using ether. I think the alcohol and ether are the same just using different chemicals. I like the sound of the powder sugar shake method as it's not supposed to kill the bees. After all, I am trying to "keep" them!
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DWV.
Check your mite loads now!!!
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Yes, there are those two methods, sugar shake and the ether method. I do mine with the sticky board placed at the bottom of the hive for 3-4 days, then count how many mites are stuck to the board, 10 mites are Too Many, time for treatment. All three methods do a good job. Some say the sugar shake is more accurate, some say the either method is more accurate, and some say the sticky board is more accurate. It's good to try all three to see what fits your mood the best.
Does your hive have a solid bottom or a screen bottom board?
I'll be looking for the link about how Randy Oliver does the math on sticky boards to tell if your hive in in trouble with mites.
Now Ted, here's another thing, I do know that an over load of varroa mites leads to deformed wing virus, but there may be something else that could cause wing deformity that I don't know about. I haven't ever started bees with a package, but I was also under the impression that you shouldn't have mites this year. So, one thing I do know about bees, is that you never know :D
Let's see what the other's have to say as well ~
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Thanks Perry! :) There ya go Ted, listen to Perry! git ta gittin' asap!
I found it! Check this out ~
http://scientificbeekeeping.com/varroa-management/
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I used the sugar shake method to look for mites. I was shooting for 1 to 2 inches of bees in the wide mouth pint jar. I found 1 mite. Good or bad? I'm thinking good? I'm also thinking none would be better. Should I take further action? Thanks, Ted
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He also has a write up about OA Vapor on his site..
He seems exceptionally concerned about the safety of the beekeeper, and uses that as his down side to OAV treatment.. but also writes...
Does vaporization hurt the bees?
Radetzki didn’t note increased bee mortality after winter treatment. Heinz Kaemmerer of Heilyser Technology Ltd. says: “We treated several colonies for 3 months during winter, once a week with the vaporizer and all colonies survived.” “With brood, colonies can be treated with the right amount of OA 3 to 4 times, a week apart; there is no harm to bees, queen or brood.” Medhat Nasr confirms that vaporized oxalic is very gentle to the bees.
12 weeks in a row? I can honestly say I have never tried that, but I do treat Spring and fall. Two applications one week apart are considered sufficient, I usually treat a third time.
The tall hive I have in my yard was two deeps when it arrived in my yard, and was treated within fifteen minutes of arrival. Within a month the DWV was gone and the hive was BOOMING with healthy bees.. After treatment it exploded with bees.. There are four supers on that hive and it looks like I will need to add more... I tested it about two weeks ago, and did not find a mite, so I did another either roll to make sure, and still did not find a mite.
This is in a hive that I pulled capped drone brood, and found an average of five or six mites in EVERY cell I opened... I have no better personal example of the effectiveness.
As far as danger to the beekeeper? I think I understand the concern.. It takes a little common sense to use OAV.. I do NOT suggest you stick a hose in the hive while it is being treated and try to breath through it.. By the same token... You need to wear gloves when applying most of the other pesticides that were relabeled as Miteasides. Dont stick your fingers in your eyes or mouth.. etc.. when using OAV don't stand over the hive breathing deeply.. Go to the battery and watch the stopwatch / clock etc.. when the 2 1/2 minutes are up unhook it, give it a moment to cool down. Let the vapor coalesce into crystals.. Lift the rag, pull the vaporizer out, re insert rag and leave it be while you prepare for the next hive.
I have NOT had any issues when treating a hive.. The problem is, you cannot regulate stupidity or carelessness. Rather than hold the person who was stupid or careless responsible, todays laws go after the manufacturer.
I see danger in just about EVERY treatment option.. Even the natural oils some use to treat with have dangers associated with them for incorrect use. So to my mind, having a little common sense goes a long way toward keeping you out of trouble.. Not that I have ever been accused of having an abundance of common sense...
If you find you have a high mite load, give me a call, set up a date, I will treat a hive to show you how it works and send you home with my vaporizer to treat your hive.
You posted while I was typing.. I have never done that type of check so do not know the efficiency..... Hopefully someone on here has, and does,and can give better advice.
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Good info there Scott!
Is there anything else that can bring on deformed wing virus besides a heavy mite load?
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AFAIK it is transferred by the mites, not the bees.. obviously if they have it, they cant fly or drift to other hives..
I will say, that up to three weeks after the first treatment of the heavily infested hives I still had crawlers.. I imagine they continue their in hive duties until it comes time to go out foraging, where they find themselves at a disadvantage.. and so, set out on the long trek to find nectar and pollen on FOOT....
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Scott- "and so, set out on the long trek to find nectar and pollen on FOOT....
Awe Geeez! That's just a little heart breaking..
Would be good food for birds and lizards ~
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I've got to say this has me at least a little freaked out. The sugar shake was hard on me, trying to shake 1 to 2 inches of bees into a jar? Took 3 frames. Most bees landed on the ground, all disoriented and a little pissed. I tried to "scoop" them from the frame into the jar, but only succeeded in rolling bees and crushing comb. Shake them like a martini? That had to hurt! Release the bees? Poor little buggers trying to fly caked in powdered sugar! Man it was terrible. If it was hard on me to do and watch, I can only imagine how it was for the bees. How do others get bees into a jar for testing? That, and I think in future I'll opt out for either ether or alcohol. Probably ether. That's what Scott does, so I'll follow suit. At least I won't have to lay in bed wondering if they survived. I was glad to see only one mite, but what could cause the deformed wing I found? AFAIK? What's that? A little bummed in Iowa, Ted
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Hey Ted:
When I have to do alcohol washes as part of my inspection duties, here's how I do it.
Get your stuff together. Measuring cup, tupperware container, windshield washer fluid (or whatever you are going to use).
Find a frame with open brood on it, preferably just before capping stage. Make sure the queen is not on that frame!
Shake the bees in one motion off the frame and into the tupperware container.
Take the tupperware container and thump all the bees in it to one corner of the container, and then scoop up the required anmount using your measuring scoop/cup.
Place the empty jar over the scoop/cup and turn it upside down, and there you have it.
Put your frame back and pour the remaing bees back into the hive.
I have found this to be the least disruptful way.
(https://worldwidebeekeeping.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fs22.postimg.cc%2Fvu8bblijh%2FTupperware.jpg&hash=79619da5b011e0edaa34a805f56cbca6dcc8e224) (http://postimg.cc/image/vu8bblijh/)
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Aye, what Perry said works well.. Another trick is to shake the bees off the frame onto the top of the tele cover then just brush or scoop/slide them into the jar. It all gets easier as you become more comfortable. No, its not ever fun.. The needs of the many, outweigh the needs of the few...
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Both the Tupperware and tele cover are GREAT ideas. Sounds a lot better than what I was doing! Thanks guys. AFAIK? This sounds like a horrible disease. Anything that needs that many letters must be bad! Feeling somewhat better in Iowa, Ted
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LOL AFAIK = As far as I know ;D
OH!!! an add/edit here.. DON'T tell the wife the bowl she is eating her salad from had bees in it yesterday.. your life will be easier if you can refrain from saying anything. Good advice!!
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First, cut most of the center of the lid out and replace it with 1/8 in. hardware cloth. Find a frame of "OPEN" brood and, with your left hand, tilt the top 45 degrees to the right. With jar nearly vertical, scoop from bottom to top of frame. About an inch of bees will be gotten each scoop. Use 2 frames if needed. Roll, twist, and gently shake the jar for about 2 minutes. Set it down for 5 minutes. Gently shake, roll, and twist for 2 minutes. Set it down for 5 more min. After 15 to 20 minutes total, roll and shake one last time.
Use a flat pan like a pie pan with 1/4 inch water in it. Turn the jar upside down and "gently" roll and shake the sugar through the wire and into the water. The sugar will melt instantly and the mites will show well against the shiny bottom of the pan.
Then open the jar and spill the bees back into the hive.
Simple, easy. and thorough. No bees harmed.
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Scott: As far as I know? really? I mean, come on! I did a Google search and came up with some REALLY bizarre sites, it had me worried!
iddee: Sounds good. Can I leave the hive open for the 15 to 20 minutes or should I close it up and open again after the test? And I do like the "gently" roll and twist. Brother, I pounded them.
My beautiful Bride and I were married fourteen (according to her, long, long, looooong) years ago. Today is our anniversary and I'm going to quit thinking about, looking at, and worrying about my bees for the next 10 or 12 hours. Spend my day "living to serve her more fully". I've found that makes for a happy home. I'll read you all tonight. Thanks Everyone, ted
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Yes, you can leave it open, or just lay the inner cover back on. Many beeks spend 30 minutes or more doing an inspection.
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I Would Treat Right Now! Read Later! Seriously!
Hi Ted- When your done celebrating your anniversary, check out the link on 'reply #6' that I sent you. You just can't read enough about different techniques regarding all facets of beekeeping.
Do one of the two methods here: Either Oxalic Acid three treatments, or Mite Away Quick Strips - Formic Acid. They are both easy and quick to use. Which ever you can get your hands on the soonest.
Like Scott says to me when I'm dawdling with a decision "Gogogogogogo!" :D
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LOL.. Wise Man Ted! And Congrats on the anniversary!!
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Oxalic acid. Is there a certain brand I should be looking for? Or, is it all the same? Ted
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I just order it through Amazon;
http://www.amazon.com/Oxalic-Acid-99%25-bag-C2H2O4/dp/B007HUR0EK/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1406054369&sr=8-1&keywords=Oxalic+Acid
99% pure. Some of the wood bleach has no information on how pure it is or what else may be in it, so to avoid problems I order the stuff that says 99% pure or better. I know folks who buy the wood bleach off the shelf and use it;
http://www.amazon.com/Savogran-10501-Wood-Bleach/dp/B002NZWY4A/ref=sr_1_14?ie=UTF8&qid=1406054369&sr=8-14&keywords=Oxalic+Acid
And have not "heard" they are having problems, but being sure makes me feel better.
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Yep, no wood bleach.
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I bought my wood bleach at LOWES and it says 100% pure OA.
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oooh!! I will have to check on that!! TY Iddee!!
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hi ted, i am just catching up here, you found one mite in the shake, and one bee with a deformed wing?
some here are suggesting that you treat for mites.......i tend to disagree, i am not one to rush to treating my bees unless it is necessary or warrants it, meaning finding one mite in a shake, or one bee with a deformed wing, for me, would not give me cause to treat for mites. ?
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Thanks Riverbee! And CONGRATULATIONS!
I was pretty freaked out at first. I still HOPE I'm doing the right thing. Like you, I'm not sure that one bee and one mite warrant immediate treatment. I'm using this week (yesterday) to order stuff I'm going to need, if not now, eventually. I just received the BT (man that was fast). I've ordered Fumagelin B, oxalic acid, and a vaporizer. I'm going to try holding off on treatment for mites until Lazybkpr treats his hives. As I said, I'm HOPING, I'm making the right choice. Again, thank you, and CONGRATULATIONS! Ted
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your welcome ted, but hmmmm, what am i being congratulated for............? :D
this is a first year package? one mite and one deformed wing in my world does not equate to treating with oxalic acid. i would not treat those bees for mites UNLESS a treatment for mites is warranted. just my humble thoughts.
i would say this, as younger beeks we tend to get freaked out about things we see and don't understand or to be honest a lot of 'junk' we have read on the interweb to scare the absolute pee out of us and think our bees are or might be suffering from, ie.....afb, efb, mites and associated mite diseases, tracheal mites, nosema apis or ceranae, etc......so we treat 'blindly' with something not knowing exactly what we are treating for or why. we do it just because we have read it or do it because another beek said so and we want to help our bees, but sometimes i think we harm them more by 'overdosing' our bees with treatments of whatever that are or might be unnecessary.....? that is just my two cents, and i hope i made sense?.....
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Not arguing Mrs River, because I agree.. First year packages really shouldnt need anything.. perhaps some fumadil B stored and capped in the fall syrup to help with nosema through the winter... But otherwise the brood break they had should tide them over well...
Ted has 1 hive at the moment, so his danger of having acquired drifting bees with mites is minimal.. however.. I have found that in situations new packages are hived near older hives the danger is greater, and the possibility of a larger mite population is also greater..
Come August.. I treat for those mites with OAV if I think they need it or not, if the Mite drop or sugar shake/either roll indicate it is necessary or not.. Why?
In my case, it is so I do not have to either roll 40 plus hives. OAV does not kill the mites because of ingestion, so the danger of them becoming resistant is null and void.. Fact or fiction? I can only say that from the first time I treated with OAV to now, I have never noticed a drop off in effectiveness. It seems to work with the same overwhelming effect time after time... The bees do not even react to it.. other treatments I have done will have them bearding or crawling all over the outside of the hive, after OAV treatments it is business as usual almost as soon as I remove the entrance blocks.
New colonies do NOT usually have a high mite count their first year, but they DO have mites...
So I guess my question would be... Why wouldn't you treat with OAV to insure low mites and strong bees for winter? Maybe I need to change my method!
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Hey folks, Where are your good wishes to Ted and his New bride of only 14 yesrs? Looong looooong time ago? When you see those 14 triple to 42, Ted, you'll be amazed at how short a time ago it was and how quickly the years passed. Double those 10-12 hours and celebrate properly with the most important person in your life. Congrats and many more happy years together---with the bees in the background.
As to deformed wings---when you find them in a hive it means that you don't need any checking for mites---you already know that they are there, and in numbers!
Don't give any thought to the subject--- your knee jerk reaction should be to treat for mites. I won't give you any recommendations, you've heard them from others. but I'll add my 2 cents to strengthen what others emphasized---treatment should last at least three weeks, only that way do you go through one cycle of brood rearing and make sure that maximum benfit can be achieved. If you add one more week, you'll take care of those mites that might be riding on the backs (or bellies) of developing drones. Oh yes, keep in mind that some treatments should not be given when there is honey for extraction in the hives. Those must be saved for post extraction use. And treat all your hives at the same time---wandering bees can quickly re-inffest a cleaned hive.
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Really Like what Scott and Ef are saying here. Deformed wing virus - it's soo very sad to watch the bees crawl across the ground. and once it comes on, it takes over quickly.
Oxalic Acid is the only way I go. It doesn't hurt the bees, or the wax, or the honey.
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Today was a good day.
Josh and I treated my hive with oxalic acid this morning, the first treatment. Yeah Yeah. I know. I changed my mind again. I decided that while the bees MIGHT be okay, I wasn't! Treating them put me back in a frame of mind where I could look at my hive with the appropriate wonder and awe instead of worry and fear, wondering if they were okay. I will say the VARROX vaporizer appears to get REALLY hot! It seems to have scorched a couple 2 or 3 frames! Is this common? I didn't see a burn on the bottom board but wonder if I just missed it.
Afterwards we went to Josh's house and set up some concrete blocks (getting them nice and level!) and laying 2, 8ft 3x12's across them for his new hives next spring. We're beginning the 2nd week of a two week "hands off" period with Josh's hive. Compared to how busy his hive was 4 or 5 weeks ago it (his hive) was almost dismally quiet. But, we'll know more next Saturday.
Having completed our assigned tasks for the day we went fishing! Caught a few Bluegill and a few Bass! When we got back here we both stretched out and took a nap! Oh man, what a tough life. Thanks, Ted
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I've been thinking about this for a few days now. I've been back and forth, should I, should I not? Should I just keep my mouth shut and go on. Keep my own counsel, think my own thoughts. Heck, I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed. Mom didn't call me son because I'm so bright. If even I see it, I'm sure others do too! But you know, to he## with that.
Efmesch, you're in Israel! Israel, my friend! The fact that you have even briefly, fleetingly, and however momentarily, thought about MY life, MY anniversary, MY petty little problems with bees absolutely blows me away! I think of the circumstances that surround and fill your life right now and, I'm speechless. For YOU to consider ME is, I don't even know what that word is! I would like to meet you one day. I would be proud to call you my friend. You're the kind of man I hope to one day be. Ted
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Amazing isnt it Ted? I really dont think there is a regular member of this forum I do not wish to meet some day..
Being like Ef when we grow up is a noble goal! ;D
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:-[ Cut the mush fellows----a little more like that and my swollen head won't fit inside of my "iron dome" :laugh:
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;D
Seriously Ef.. Keep your head down! and keep us updated!
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Last weekend I treated the hive for the first time with oxalic acid and immediately afterwards did a hive inspection. By the time we were done inspecting it was obvious that the bees were done too. For the next few days they (the bees) didn't seem to appreciate me being near their hive. So, I complied by maintaining my distance. Saturday (yesterday) I treated the hive for the second time with oxalic acid, with no hive inspection afterwards. The bees remain as docile as always. Maybe too much IS too much.
This morning I noticed what I thought/think were dead verroa on their front porch. I took one inside and inspected it under a magnifying glass. Couldn't really tell much other than it was an insect. I could make out legs on one side of it. It appeared as if it died in agony, all curled up. And no, as much as it pains me to say it, I don't feel bad in the least. I counted 14 dead verroa on the porch.
In a strange way this whole episode makes me feel more like a beekeeper. I found a problem, sought advise, made a decision, and took action that appears to be helping. Okay, so yeah, it didn't happen EXACTLY that fast, but, well, it did happen. Thanks Everyone, Ted
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Finding varroa on the porch after a treatment is normal, it means your bees are house cleaning or at least trying to. It can be shocking to see just how many mites are on a bottom board after an initial treatment with Oxalic..
In regards to MAQS, a 7 day treatment is all that's required (they are spent after that anyways). The formic acid is so powerful it penetrates the cappings and kills the varroa that are in capped brood cells, thereby reducing the treatment time. It can and does sometimes halt queens laying for few days. It can also be used with honey supers left on.
Geez, reading this almost makes me sound like a distributor (I'm not). I've just had two years of good success using it.
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Same here Perry, I love OA, MAQS is second choice. MAQS saved my one and only hive last fall. Then I went to OA.
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Ihave used Hopguard, but was les than impressed after a "single" treatment.. I found that applying the max recommended for one year back to back had a much more significant impact on the mites.. but that also means you cant use the hopguard again that year.. OAV has been working like the proverbial silver bullet so far.. if it ever starts to fail I will use MAQS..
Perhaps the "NEW" Hopgaurd two is better? No experience with it so cannot say..
I am glad to hear the treatments went OK Ted. I like to think I have pretty docile bees, but as you found out.. (We both did) when they get riled it takes em a bit to calm down.
Ted showed up, came over and sat down, then giggled while I tried to smack down a couple of persistent bees that were pinging off my forehead.. Then one of them decided Ted looked like a better target and pegged him on the cheek.. So we moved back to the shed to talk after that...
The next morning I was capable of once again wandering through the hives unmolested.
I am not sure the mechanism the bees use to alert each other, but it seems that I can inspect colonies thoroughly through the first four to six colonies, after that they seem to start getting aggrivated.. can other colonies pick up on the alarm pheromone? Is it just the upset bees flying about? I cant say, but usually by colony six I have to put the hood up. JUST doing inspections they do seem to calm down within a few minutes of ending the inspections.. When I have to move hives, change bottom boards etc, they remain angry for a longer time.
When I treat with OAV.. I usually do not inspect or fuss with them otherwise and have not had a problem. When treating with Hopguard they are upset. Not terribly so, but it is a noticeable difference. A little more bearding and more warnings if I wander about among them.
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Scott- "When I treat with OAV.. I usually do not inspect or fuss with them otherwise and have not had a problem.
Same here, it's like nothing ever happened.. except dead mites :)
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"Not arguing Mrs River, because I agree.. First year packages really shouldnt need anything.. perhaps some fumadil B stored and capped in the fall syrup to help with nosema through the winter."......... "New colonies do NOT usually have a high mite count their first year, but they DO have mites...
So I guess my question would be... Why wouldn't you treat with OAV to insure low mites and strong bees for winter? Maybe I need to change my method!"
scott, sorry for the delayed reply. i changed MY method. having grown weary of a losing battle with the mites, (and long cold winters) i switched to russian bees, and i have never looked back. i hope no one misunderstands my posts on treatment of bees. if it's necessary, it's necessary, but i think sometimes we over treat our bees. i would agree first year packages typically should not need anything except some fumadil, however, i have seen packages arrive with mite problems. randy oliver has a great article on the treatment of bees, and like starvation or any other malady, i would not want my bees to suffer and would feed and treat accordingly. nature is not kind to bees and as oliver says "good husbandry is all about keeping your colonies alive and healthy!" i believe in this, and practice this to the best of my knowledge and ability, no different than any other livestock or valued family pet/critter.
The "Rules" for Successful Beekeeping (http://scientificbeekeeping.com/the-rules-for-successful-beekeeping/)
like i said before i do believe that beginning beekeepers have a challenge and get freaked out by things they see and don't understand. they are told to do many things by well meaning beeks or mentors, but have no idea why they are doing so, just that they have been told to do so. as beekeepers, we need to understand the biology of the mite, and the different ways to guage when to treat, so that we can make better informed decisions for ourselves, or with the help of someone else with experience who is standing with us in our hives to make decisions. and also to fully understand and comprehend the effects of any treatment and to follow the directions explicitly to the letter of any treatment. and practice rotation of the combs.
during the past 12+ years, i have treated the russians for mites with apiguard gel, maybe 3 times. the only reason i did was because i had two neighbors, one a mile away, the other about 3.....who decided to try bees. they neither treated nor fed their bees and a myriad of other goofball things... their bees and their mites wound up in my hives not to mention the robbing problems. i tried to work with them and educate them to no avail. i was very happy when they both decided keeping bees wasn't for them. it was very hard for me to watch the starvation and these hives succumbing to mite infestations, and how much this affected my own hives.
russian bees aren't for everyone, and probably not a real good choice for me at this time in my life, but since keeping them, i am and have been relatively treatment free for mites.
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Riv- "like i said before i do believe that beginning beekeepers have a challenge and get freaked out by things they see and don't understand. they are told to do many things by well meaning beeks or mentors, but have no idea why they are doing so, just that they have been told to do so.
HooWee! I can relate to that! So misguided and naive in the beginning. Since I've been on this forum now for 7 months, I'm just now starting to learn to relax a bit with my hives... I recieve such educated structure here... :)
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Agreed completely.
I think I knew you had Russian bees, just has not registered for a while.
I like the OAV for bees that DO need treated because of the lack of residue and other harmful side effects. For a new beekeeper it removes the RISKS associated with treating incorrectly and or at the wrong time. Just one less thing to worry about. If it makes the new beekeeper FEEL better, he, or she can treat with the OAV, and of they did not NEED the treatment it still does not harm the bees, and DOES kill a few mites along the way. I am not advocating treating if the bees do not need it, just using a product that allows a margin of error without harmful side effects. Being overwhelmed and not fully understanding the different treatments and methods, and/or what the threshold is or how to check it accurately comes with time and experience.
I failed alcohol washes, sugar shakes etc the first few times I did them.. I was not even entirely sure what I was looking for back then. Scooping bees in to a jar was quite stressful for me, and I can only assume it was the bees as well.. It took me a bit of time to gain confidence in what I was doing. So being able to treat, even if they didnt need it because they are not SURE, but want to MAKE sure is a great amount of weight removed from the shoulders of a new beekeeper. The stuff I started with scared the bejeesus out of me putting it in the hives. Using something less nasty would have been a lot more reassuring. Again, that is not saying they SHOULD treat without checking, it is saying it gives them the time and confidence to be able to perfect their methods and ability while keeping their bees alive, without harming them from "overcare".
That is what I was trying to get across..
For me, with 40+ hives now, it means I can check 6 to 8 hives, and if the mite levels are high I can treat ALL of the hives. If there are a couple that did not need it, there was no harm done. If I had to check the mite levels on all hives it would be a long day in the bee yard and a lot more bees would die. A little freedom from worry, for a new beekeeper, or an old one!
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Scott- "I failed alcohol washes, sugar shakes etc the first few times I did them.. I was not even entirely sure what I was looking for back then. Scooping bees in to a jar was quite stressful for me, and I can only assume it was the bees as well.. It took me a bit of time to gain confidence in what I was doing. So being able to treat, even if they didnt need it because they are not SURE, but want to MAKE sure is a great amount of weight removed from the shoulders of a new beekeeper. The stuff I started with scared the bejeesus out of me putting it in the hives.
Ditto on that! For me I had a hard time killing a cup full of bees just for a mite count. OAV saved me that agony. I mean aren't we supposed to be saving the bees instead of killing them? That may seem extreme to some others but it was important to me ~
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Does sound a bit extreme coming from someone who collects bees just to let them sting people and die. :P ;D :D
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OOOHohohoho! Good One Mr. Wizard.. Good... One!!
In my defense, I may use 1 bee to help people in a medicinal way, mainly pain relief. That is completely different than killing 300 bees to see how many nasty fluid suckers there are clinging to them, when using a sticky board alleviates that uneccessary slaughter.