Worldwide Beekeeping
Beekeeping => General Beekeeping => Topic started by: Yankee11 on July 31, 2014, 09:54:51 pm
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Had a guy call me tonight. He bought 2 nucs from me back in April. He calls me July 31st to tell me that he doesn't think they have done all that well
this summer. He put them in an out yard far from his house.
The other one he has by his house and can check on them daily. He says its doing really great.
So, I told him I would go by tomorrow and do an inspection and see what I see.
So, I want to do the right thing here, BUT 3 to 4 months later and they are out away from his house. I know some of they other nucs I sold were building swarm cells about a month after the owners took them home.
I asked him if they could have swarmed on him and he said maybe, he can't check them that often.
A lot can happen in 3 to 4 months with bees.
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I would simply tell him to bring them home where he could care for them. If he hurries, he should be able to get them strong enough to winter over.
Otherwise, I would be willing to sell him a nuc each April for the outyard.
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Thanks Iddee,
I am going to inspect them tomorrow as I have committed to him to do that. I kind am curious anyway. I will be able to tell my frames from his, so i can see if they pulled any new stuff.
If I see a queen and brood I will suggest as you say.
I guess next spring I will figure out how to let customer know they don't come with a 90 warranty.
He said he put them in a good spot with plenty of food. Really?
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I fully understand wanting to do the right thing.. But there is SO MUCH that can go wrong that YOU have no control over.. From pesticides to swarming because he did not watch them close enough being so far away..
So long as you sell a good healthy nuc you are confident in, the queen is laying well etc, there is no further liability on your part...
Once it rolls off of your property, they could damage the queen in transit or pulling the frames, etc, etc, etc, etc...
IF.. he is a good customer, or a good person etc, I may go out of my way to see that the nuc is "fixed up" or replaced, if they/he is a pain or is nasty, has an attitude etc then they are on their own. I will work with an idiot if they are trying, I won't go out of my way for someone who does NOT try.
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Thanks Lazy,
I had a customer that bought 3 nucs from me and 4 or 5 weeks later called me panicking because they were finding the start of swarm cells and got caught without their 2nd deep and frames. I told her to come out and I let her borrow 3 deeps and the frames/foundation. She repayed me later, with interest. Extra frames etc.
I will see where this goes tomorrow.
Being new to selling nucs, I didn't sell anything questionable. But, so far he seems like a nice guy, I would have recommended him not separate the 2 hives like that had I known he was going to that. AT least until they built out the first deep.
I am guessing they swarmed on him.
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If I decide to fix him up or replace, should i offer to just wait until spring. I am worried if I do something now and it doesn't make through winter he may call me saying they died during the winter.
Or fix now and let him know he is on his own.
I just sent a guy off tonight with 2 nucs and I stressed, stressed, feed them until Goldenrod starts to bloom. or until they no longer take it down.
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I would simply tell him to bring them home where he could care for them. If he hurries, he should be able to get them strong enough to winter over.
Otherwise, I would be willing to sell him a nuc each April for the outyard.
That's a great answer! :eusa_clap:
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When one purchases a nuc, he should expect a laying queen with some brood, honey and pollen stored. It should be at least four frames of the latter. It should be in a propagating mode. If it's just a nice small bee colony that is expanding, that is very acceptable. It has all of these things it is in the new owner's hands, and it is his responsibility.
Were I in the business, I would make him a good deal on a couple of replacement nucs, but I wouldn't beat myself up about not treating him fairly.
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If I decide to fix him up or replace, should i offer to just wait until spring.
I would think in Arkansas you have a about a month longer than we do up here, but its all weather/flow dependent. So answering the question would amount to how knowledgeable this fellow is as well as/or how hard he is trying.
He does need to understand that with live bees, there is no lifetime warranty, but that you DO offer an extended warranty for $XXX.00. ;D
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I wonder if he is a newbee.
My local club has had problems with some folk starting beekeeping. They call in experienced members about a problem. Then another visit request. It can almost get to the stage of the hives being worked for them.
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This is a fantastic topic and thanks goes to Yankee11 for starting it.
I started selling nucs last year, and sold 60 this year. I have had several instances of folks calling with "problems".
I have taken it upon myself to go out of my way to try and help these folks. It is what sets me apart from the "that's beekeeping" competition.
Yes, it costs me in time and travel, and can be frustrating at times, but if you want to become known as the guy to go to for a nuc, sometimes that's what it takes.
I try and impress upon people that I will provide them them a quality nuc, and will gladly do follow up as far as advice and guidance, but that I cannot guarantee success.
Given that this is 3 to 4 months after sale Yankee11, I commend you for going out and looking, but at this point you have absolutely no obligation to offer any "deals".
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""If I decide to fix him up or replace, should i offer to just wait until spring.""
Fix him up with knowledge and assistance free of charge.
Fix him up with bees and equipment at regular price.
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Thanks everybody,
I will post back what I find out in the hive today.
This guy has had bees before but they died out on him, He brought me his old boxes to put them in. But I would consider him a newbie by the questions he
by the questions he started asking me after he got them home back in April.
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Our ex state Beekeepers Assco. president sells nucs, he goes through them with the buyer showing them the queen,work force,brood and patterned. He also tells them the warranty stops when there tail lights get out of sight. :laugh: Jack
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Ok,
So I pull up this morning the where the hive is, I see it sitting out there as single deep still. I am thinking to myself "thats not good, still in a single deep".
I get my jacket on and go to the hive. There are bees at the entrance so I know there are bees in it. It takse a bit to get top off as he doesn't have a inner cover.
I pop top off and it's bad alright. The thing is cram packed with bees. :laugh:
(https://worldwidebeekeeping.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fs27.postimg.cc%2Fo1f9jb88v%2F20140801_093243.jpg&hash=8eb4669e66f1f7a3fec79e1790d62a4a521110de) (http://postimg.cc/image/o1f9jb88v/)
He told me last night, "They just havn't done well all summer" So I put the lid back on after mumbling a few things under my breath (it stayes between me and the bees). I get in my truck and call him. I say "you have a problem allright, you can't cram another bee in that box". While talking to me he admits he hasn't opened box since he got them from me.
I'll go as far as to bet they have even swarmed on him. He got these before the flow started and it's a 9 frame box. I knew I sold good products, but he sure had me worried a little last night.
.
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sorry he wasted your time Yankee. what did he think? that the bees would super themselves? how could he know that they weren't doing well with out even looking in side? He must think he is intelligent to be able to do a hive inspection at the entrance by watching the bees come and go. I think we need to sign up for his fast how to do a hive inspection with out looking at the bees.
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Maybe I should have told him I would give him half his money back and brought them home and split them into 3 strong nucs
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Lol Apis,
The bees that super themselves cost more than 140.00. I have actually been laughing about the whole situation all day.
The guy should be eating some of his own Honey by now.
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Refer to my first reply. Now you know why.
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With the plight of the honey bee being all the rage as of late, there has been a major upswing in the number of new registered beekeepers here in Nova Scotia, and I am sure most everywhere. Many folks are getting into it to "help the honey bee", a noble and good gesture to be sure. One of my major concerns about it all is there also seems to be an inordinate number of new folks that think that providing a home for them is all they really need to do.
"I'm not in it for the honey", or, "I'm not interested in the honey" seem to be what I hear a lot of lately.
Folks set their hives up, and then call me when they perceive what might be a problem, without actually going into the hive to check.
(this is not directed to those I've visited recently ;))
Folks, you have to get in there and look, it's the only way I know of to check a hive. You won't learn anything about your hive, any other way!
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As with everything in beekeeping. I am learning with everything new I venture into. Selling nucs, no different.
I am thinking of writing up something to give with each nuc I sell next year, it will have steps for setup and care for the first several weeks after getting their
new nuc home. Kinda like with a new puppy or goldfish. Included in the "Instruction Sheet" will be verbage about the extent of the warranty once the nuc leaves my property.
Might word it a little differently than their tail lights being out of site. :D brooks.
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Oh good grief.. You know, its not really the time to go there, but in a way it IS the time, the time you spent wondering what happened and why, and would you end up eating the cost of another nuc... etc..
I like the idea of a pamphlet.. Just wonder how many would read it.. Maybe read it in front of them then hand it to them to remind them.. I would keep the tail light warranty by all means.. SHOW them what you have, what you are selling, and tell them NOT to take it if they are not perfectly confident and satisfied, because $h*# happens to bees even if they do everything right.
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I'm thinking the ones that don't read it probably don't need to.
Like Perry says, seems to be a lot of new people getting into it. They are the ones that may not understand, and being new, I bet they would read it. Everyone on this forum would not have to read it, but we are not the ones we would have to worry about either.
I am just thinking out loud.
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I'll take a hundred copies of it to pass out at the beginner beekeeper's course in Jan.
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Iddee there lies the problem. It is not the ones that have taken the beginner beekeeping course that are going to have the problem. It is the one's that only do enough research as to find or make equipment and where to buy packages or nucs from. I know a couple of beekeepers that will not sell a nuc to a person until they take his beginning beekeeping course, or he knows you have kept bees.
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After looking at that hive, I am appalled that anyone could be so derelict in their husbandry and complain about anything. A couple of decades back, I would have given that guy a piece of my mind and more if he so desired.
I agree with Iddee, give them free advice and council, but your warranty expires when your tail lights are no longer visible.
I wish I had the hive that Yankee11 showed in his picture. If I lived close to that guy, I would give him his money back and take the hive.
I have found most people to be honest, and it seems to me that my fellow beekeepers are more honest and giving of their time and resources than any other group of folks that I have been associated with. This client is one of those spoiled people that think that nothing is their fault. He has what I call the "victim mentality."
Anyway, I'm done with this thread, but it has been an interesting one, and I have learned from it.
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.....I am thinking of writing up something to give with each nuc I sell next year, it will have steps for setup and care for the first several weeks after getting their
new nuc home....
Randy Oliver put his NUC instructions online for beginners, (click here to see his page). (http://scientificbeekeeping.com/first-year-care-for-your-nuc/) HTH :)
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I have never sold nucs, and have people beg me to sell them some. I have heard just about all the problems (like those mentioned above) and more, which makes me wonder if it's worth it or not? I like to meet and help new beekeepers get started, but with all the irons i have in the fire it probably would be a aggravation i don't need :-\. Still debating if i want to start next spring selling nucs ??? Jack
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Thanks Lb.
Brooks,
Selling nucs really was a good experience. I have sold about 15 or 16 and not had any problems. This one was a little headache but I will learn to handle these kind out as I go. All the other have gone extremely well. So, 1 out of 15 is not bad.
My real job is an on site service technician. Every time I hear from a customer, they always have a problem, or they would not be calling me. 100% of the time. So 1 issue out of 15 is a big change for me. :)
I actually heard from another customer last night telling me how good her 2 hives are doing. Just had to put on her first supers. Just funny how she happened to reach out to me on the same day this other happened.
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No news is good news.. It IS nice to get good feedback once in a while though.
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excellent thread here yankee!