Worldwide Beekeeping
Beekeeping => Swarms, Cut Outs, Trap Outs and Bee Trees => Topic started by: Gypsi on September 02, 2014, 07:06:35 pm
-
The bees are in poor condition. The swarm call came in to bee club on Friday, no one got there, so the homeowner called someone off the internet. This wasn't a swarm, but the bees are not hot either. Homeowner has been running a lawnmower around them without issue all year.
Then came the internet bee rescuers: I got over there this morning after dropping off the last grand. Some bee removal person from the internet, forgot the hose for their bee vac, tore up the hive fairly well and sprayed them with soapy water, before declaring them aggressive and suitable to kill. They are not aggressive. I stood a foot from the tree poking around inside and they did not try to sting. About 1/3 to 1/2 seem to have survived the soapy water, pile of dead bees at the base of the tree, most of their brood is destroyed and I doubt they had many stores with the drought. Going to set up a trap out and bring what I can catch home. No way to cut out without killing his tree. He's getting windowscreen, I can handle the rest, probably not doing a Hogan style trap this time.
I've just read Iddee's trap out instructions. The bee tree has a 6 foot vertical slit, and a side entrance about 1.5 inches in diameter about 4 feet off the ground. I think I am going to totally cover the vertical slit with windowscreen, screwed on with pipe strap reinforcement and silicone seal as well. Mount the trap out to the small side entrance.
Wish me luck!
Gypsi
-
Good luck! Post some pics!
-
Go get'em, the alternative can't be worse. It sounds like you'll be doing this standing on the ground so that's a plus. Pics would be great. ;)
-
You could use your weakest hive and boost it's numbers. They will join together without fighting.
Good Luck.
-
I would like to see more bee tree stuff, looking forward to this story Gypsi :)
-
sending you some good mojo gypsi! good luck to ya' !!!!
and......(https://worldwidebeekeeping.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1056.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ft373%2Friverbee1%2FEmoticons%2FWeNeedPicsSmilie_zps2f8154de.png&hash=c6cc44554ddf1f503ccc411c3779954554ce3ec2)......if you can!
looking forward to any update from you..... ;)
-
well here is the photo. going to seal this long crevice in with window screen, edges reinforced with pipestrap, screws and GE Silicone II. Small opening on the side is about 1.5 inches in diameter. Making cone tonight, hoping I can get a frame of eggs and brood from my ladies in the morning. Homeowner is a nice guy, loves this old hackberry (which a strong wind will probably bring down but I am not gonna break his heart telling him that.). He is quite disappointed at the pile of dead bees left by the soapy water sprayed by the bee removal people he found on the internet that promised to take them for free, forgot their hose and killed most of them.
Bees are very calm so I think the queen is still there. Anyway here is the pic, I have to do the cone tonight so silicone can cure on it.
http://i338.photobucket.com/albums/n406/gypsi_fw/16f2700a-d3e7-4ae5-a2d1-56e58185cedd_zps45f37e6a.jpg
-
thanks for the update and photo gypsi!
good luck!
-
ok, putting the images in order, there is a description. Exhausted need a shower and bed.
http://i338.photobucket.com/albums/n406/gypsi_fw/Bee%20and%20Garden%20Stuff/Bees/beetree%20trapout%20Sep%203%202014/screenconecloseup_zpse935e768.jpg
http://i338.photobucket.com/albums/n406/gypsi_fw/Bee%20and%20Garden%20Stuff/Bees/beetree%20trapout%20Sep%203%202014/initialtowerposition_zpsaab9824c.jpg
http://i338.photobucket.com/albums/n406/gypsi_fw/Bee%20and%20Garden%20Stuff/Bees/beetree%20trapout%20Sep%203%202014/treesealed_zps7d3b3d63.jpg
http://i338.photobucket.com/albums/n406/gypsi_fw/Bee%20and%20Garden%20Stuff/Bees/beetree%20trapout%20Sep%203%202014/towerattachedside_zps0581e336.jpg
http://i338.photobucket.com/albums/n406/gypsi_fw/Bee%20and%20Garden%20Stuff/Bees/beetree%20trapout%20Sep%203%202014/towerattachedfront_zps54fd6a71.jpg
http://i338.photobucket.com/albums/n406/gypsi_fw/Bee%20and%20Garden%20Stuff/Bees/beetree%20trapout%20Sep%203%202014/cone2nucbees_zps3afe1f8b.jpg
There is a frame of fresh eggs and young brood. Some of the nurse bees would not stay with their hive so they came along, hope all goes well; it was my younger hive and queen's frame, they really couldn't spare it, but neither could the big hive.
On the bright side, last week's cutout seems to have a queen, the size open brood I saw sure looks too small for what I put in on Monday
-
Gypsi... You're amazing... with I was a mouse in your shirt pocket watching you and your bees :)
-
Hey Gypsi, good on you for giving this a go!
Any chance you could turn your box sideways so that the base of the cone is closer to the the entrance? The tip of the cone doesn't need to be close, the base of the cone should be.
Something like this.
(https://worldwidebeekeeping.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fs29.postimg.cc%2Frglp7jznn%2FBee_tree_and_Trap_out_024.jpg&hash=8772998ab9aa5644648d1b8ba484b09bd3296d4e) (http://postimg.cc/image/rglp7jznn/)
-
hmm, Perry maybe. the tilt on the suport due to the tilt on the land to get close to the tree, not sure I can
-
Lay a board under the tree side of the box to level it after turning it 90 degrees. What Perry said is very important in a trap out.
-
Jen you would want an a/c unit in that pocket, it was about 110 in my suit yesterday, lol.
Perry, I'm going to look over there around noon today, but if I turn it, it will have west (hot) wind entering the hive full face on, and if it rains this weekend, not just rain. That is a solid bottom board, sturdier for its perch. I am not sure whether turning it would be a good idea. I can't turn it east without reworking the whole "perch" and that was not an easy perch. What do you think on wind/rain entry into the nuc?
-
I would think as along as it slopes so that rain runs out you would be fine. It's given that the bees return to the base of the cone when returning, and will find and enter the box with brood much quicker if the entrance is right there. I'm not saying what you have won't work, but changing it would be well worth the effort.
-
I made the effort, it isn't perfect, photo later, but those little nurse bees on the eggframes seem to be telling the hive bees to hit the road, and of course the hive bees aren't showing up with groceries either. Hoping things improve, I saw a field of goldenrod, big one, less than a mile from that hive.
-
You've done all a person can, the rest is up to the bees. The goldenrod will hopefully be giving up nectar if it's not too dry there.
-
When I got half an inch of rain a couple of weeks ago these people got 2 inches. Our rain now comes in spots where 2 inches fall in an hour, and 10 miles away nothing fell at all. So the bees there, were it not for the guys that sprayed them with soapy water, would have been in fair shape for food. Thank you all for your help
-
UPDATE: Just talked to my homeowner. What with sick dogs and busy ponds and aquarium fish trying to die on me I haven't been over there in 10 days. Bees hardly mess with the screened in tree at all, no bees visible inside tree, the box is occupied and bees come and go from it, 2 or 3 guard bees looked him over but not aggressive.
I just ordered 2 queens. Homeowner's question, and mine, is whether the queen came out and joined them in the box. It will probably be Friday before I can get over there and look, unless I get off work early tomorrow. The eggs I took over there are 13 days old now. Not sure what I will find when I open the box but sure after a day in heat and humidity I am too tired for ladder work today, so I just ordered queens.
Iddee? Anyone else? Am I likely to find the queen in the box? The soapy water guys destroyed most of their hive before I got, there, might she come and move into my cozy little nuc box?
-
The eggs will be queens by Friday. If you have a virgin queen, you may not see her. Look for an area with polished cells and pollen/honey around them. If the tree queen came out and went in the hive, you will have eggs.
The tree hive likely was overtaken by SHB, so the bees are not going back in.
-
No SHB. Actually the tree hive was taken over by 2 idiots spraying soapy water in it because it wasn't an easy to catch swarm, and they destroyed most of the comb and brood. Then I took the grandbaby home and could finally call the home over, I've salvaged what I could. Karma will have to catch up with them. I am going to check this morning. I have a fresh queen with attendants. I can't let the virgin live, she stands no chance of mating whatsoever, we go from 100's to 60's and the drones get thrown out... A mated queen will make it through the winter.
-
ok, laying worker or laying queen? http://i338.photobucket.com/albums/n406/gypsi_fw/P9190482_zps0dc2846e.jpg
-
If it were a laying worker those would look like drone cells right?
-
yes. Do they look like drone cells to you?
-
Not to me, not in this pic anyway, the caps would be sticking out like bullet heads if these were drone cells. Would maybe be better to see a pic of the whole face of the frame. Then we could determine how many worker bee cells and drone cells.
-
most of the frame is empty foundation. The bees built a couple of patches of comb for her to lay in, and I was shooting one handed, mid air, over the hive so I didn't drop anyone. Capped brood top left, eggs below, bottom right uncapped brood. The other pics were blurry
-
Queen laid eggs. Could be drones or workers, but not laid by workers. More pics in a week, please.
-
may not be able to do more pics. Swapping the hive for help getting it off the guy's property, but to a semi experienced new beek. If he sends me pics I will forward them.
-
Get him on the forum, and tell him to post them.
-
Sending him a link right now. He will need help and advice and I'm sending him here. We NEED beeks in their 20's and 30's to get good advice and support
-
Hi guys :) I'm the newbie that got the bees, and thank you gypsi. I'm keeping them wrapped up for now, but I can post some pics tomorrow. Wish me luck :) It's been 20 years (since I was about 12) since I had any hives...so I'm rusty but incredibly excited about it. Any advice is always welcome of course.
-
Hi ledifni :) You will get plenty of good sound advice here. Fun place to take a break everday ;)
-
ledifni....
looking forward to your pix! and again WELCOME!!!!!!
-
New hive laid out:
(https://worldwidebeekeeping.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fs28.postimg.cc%2Fqfrkmld61%2F20140927_103549.jpg&hash=df0e2bfd68021e0d6759997b01162068eef93bfb) (http://postimg.cc/image/qfrkmld61/)
Before you ask, yes, I did paint this hive. I used a clear sealant to preserve the natural wood look :) I like it better that way.
The original nuc, still closed:
(https://worldwidebeekeeping.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fs3.postimg.cc%2F4bjl9t8vj%2F20140927_103609.jpg&hash=5945cc9b28c50108389820ac492a233fddad89f1) (http://postimg.cc/image/4bjl9t8vj/)
Now open. These bees were quite gentle. They occasionally expressed their displeasure (loudly), but no actual stings even on the suit or gloves. Just some buzzing and complaining. I just used a tiny bit of smoke when I first opened it -- didn't need any after that.
(https://worldwidebeekeeping.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fs14.postimg.cc%2Fmkgx8vf8d%2F20140927_110007.jpg&hash=36291a6d8feb146f315ef8d095800f12c0791543) (http://postimg.cc/image/mkgx8vf8d/)
All but one frame now in the new hive:
(https://worldwidebeekeeping.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fs7.postimg.cc%2Fof6lbo82f%2F20140927_111505.jpg&hash=b4447b4abc8f7299e2057f4d183427add620066c) (http://postimg.cc/image/of6lbo82f/)
Finished! All the frames are in the new hive, then I just had to dump bees out of the empty nuc so I could move it away.
(https://worldwidebeekeeping.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fs28.postimg.cc%2Fdazhwkj55%2F20140927_112354.jpg&hash=4c8f7b6fef4cf87e355485a03a047c9b289d25a0) (http://postimg.cc/image/dazhwkj55/)
Some pictures of comb. The first one is egg cells, but I'm a terrible photographer when I'm carrying a frame and I took it at a bad angle -- sorry. In the second one, though, you can see capped brood and several open cells with larvae.
(https://worldwidebeekeeping.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fs9.postimg.cc%2F522vkjmx7%2F20140927_111631.jpg&hash=a005173d7ec41759ed656fc555c4bd1679972efd) (http://postimg.cc/image/522vkjmx7/)
(https://worldwidebeekeeping.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fs27.postimg.cc%2Fc9t8jvdov%2F20140927_111643.jpg&hash=afa6e943cdfbe7292ba1dde0fd48940664fa0292) (http://postimg.cc/image/c9t8jvdov/)
And...the closed up hive. Ain't she pretty :D
(https://worldwidebeekeeping.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fs8.postimg.cc%2Feaba6ma5d%2F20140927_113053.jpg&hash=ec8e918cba5622c83010cc90c108e02b0745ffa0) (http://postimg.cc/image/eaba6ma5d/)
(https://worldwidebeekeeping.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fs30.postimg.cc%2Fiz3wuff99%2F20140927_113103.jpg&hash=54ae407b851173c90d710c8a96ebf4acfda0e512) (http://postimg.cc/image/iz3wuff99/)
(https://worldwidebeekeeping.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fs18.postimg.cc%2Fiex5gafmd%2F20140927_112949.jpg&hash=66d19d48b31f5d0fad4d45cd3050e6aa9fb10ead) (http://postimg.cc/image/iex5gafmd/)
Thank you Gypsi! Very excited. Wish me luck wintering these bees. Fortunately Texas has very light winters so I have high hopes for them.
-
Nice pics and happy for you Ledifni! Looking forward to watching this hive make thru the winter, grow and prosper :eusa_clap:
Might I give you a word of advice? At some point before you close up the hive for winter, you should probably gently scrape off the wonky comb so that the frames fit snuggly together. Then, when they are all back in the hive, push them together towards the center. There will be some gap between the wall of the hive and the frames. If you don't, your hive could be a mess of gnarly comb to sort out, and the bees don't like that in the spring.
(https://worldwidebeekeeping.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fs14.postimg.cc%2F96nn5gtel%2FDSCF6797.jpg&hash=ce5bbbc41c92e35c24d91bbf569141764ece2d68) (http://postimg.cc/image/96nn5gtel/)
-
I very much want to hear advice and thank you :)
Yes, there's at least one frame that is very wonky (and wide)...I was actually thinking about that as I placed it in the hive. I was worried that I might damage brood comb, and since they really aren't well-prepared for winter I'm afraid to kill any brood at all (our ruin honey for that matter). My thought is, which will hurt them more, destroying comb now or making them mad in spring?
To be honest I don't know the answer to that question. Be happy to hear what you guys think :)
-
Mkay Led, I got on this forum in January. And as I took lots of pics and posted them, these fine mentors helped me get my hives back into good shape. Wonky comb everywhere! I didn't think about it to much until they told me the danger points.
The first thing I was taught about wonky or bulging comb, is that when you slowly pull up your frames, or slowly lower them back into position in the hive box... you could easily roll and kill the queen. This kind of comb it too tight of a fit. And you wouldn't even know it until the next time you do an inspection. That is a sad thing to happen to a hive.
It's scary at first scraping off that bulging comb or comb hanging from the lid.. but it has to be done. And it's going to feel like and look like armageddon during the process. Have Gypsi with you if you need.
Give this hive a week or so to get settled down, then go in and start cleaning up the frames with weird comb.
Then, when your done with that process push the frames snuggly together towards the center. This way they don't have room to build wonky comb. It will be so much easier in the spring when you go in and lift up your frames :)
-
Yeah I see your point. As long as you don't think it will unduly harm my ladies, I'll go ahead and do it next time I open them (next week sometime). I have beetle sheets to put in and I may replace those outer medium frames with deep frames since I'll have some by then...but not if they've already got that comb drawn out. If they have, then I'll just let them build off the bottoms of those frames for now I think.
-
Each time you go into the hive, push the frames together enough that you have 1/4 inch between the combs or a bit less. The next time in, the bees will have opened the space up. Do it again then. There's no need for you to trim comb from the frame. They will do it for you.
-
great pix ledifini! and i do wish you luck for overwintering! you will do just fine. btw she is purty!........... :D
-
Beautiful photos, and good advice too. One more comment. Actually two. It looked like you put all the empty frames on one side of the hive, generally when I upsize into a larger box I put the existing hive frames in the same order in the larger box and fill in empties on both outer edges.
2nd thing, entrance reducer. Little scrap of 1x2, wadded up tin foil, anything, you need that entrance not much over 4 bees width and one bee height at this time of year in a drought in North Texas, or you can lose your small hive to a robbing larger hive pretty easily. Particularly do not add any essential oils to your feed, do not use HoneyBeHealthy, etc or it is like a flag that says "rob me". Except for my largest hive, all of mine are on entrance reducers turned to the 2 bee width, low height, just enough for the undertaker bees to be able to haul out bodies. There is a little traffic jam from returning workers but not too bad. Also take care not to spill syrup or honey and watch for drips..
I fought a large robbing hive for over a month before losing my second hive (at 7 frames) to the robbers. At the time it was my only hive. Heartbreaking and frustrating. It was something like October 3, 2011, so around this time of year.
Gypsi
-
Well, you had five frames and my hive fits 8 so I put on empty on one side and two on the other. But yes the original frames are all in the middle :) I don't have room for the entrance reducer with that feeder in there...I could make one though. I might just make a top feeder instead and use the entrance reducer that came with the bottom board. Probably safer that way in any case.
-
For an entrance reducer, just cut a block of wood 1/2 to 3/4 inch shorter than your opening. Place it against the feeder. Leave the opening next to the outside of the bottom board.
Yes, top feeders are much safer from robbers than front feeders.
-
Yep, just made a top feeder from a mason jar and put it over the hole in the inner cover. It strikes me that refilling a top feeder is also a lot less intrusive.