Worldwide Beekeeping
Beekeeping => General Beekeeping => Topic started by: Jen on January 01, 2015, 10:01:14 pm
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Haven't ever opened a hive this time of year, had to work quickly.
Hive 1: Saw no bees in the the super frames, but did hear them below, and 2 or 3 poked their heads out the entrance. Got a quick look in between the frames, all capped honey as far as I could see. Placed fondant in middle of top frames, then spacer, inner cover, lid.
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Hive 2: Didn't hear bees, nor see them, but there are very few dead bees as far as I could see thru the entrance, no more than 10
Hive 3: This hive is a deep, a super, and a super. I can't remember (20 lashes didn't write it down) whether the deep or the middle medium had the brood this last fall, I was intructed to leave it be for the winter.
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My own scenario. The bees chimneyed up thru the capped honey and these bees are the top of the cluster?
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How cold was it when you opened? Just curious.
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About 40 no wind
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I usually just put the fondant over the inner cover hole so as not to disturb the cluster. In the spring I might slide a super thin patty under the inner cover, but only if it's a do-or-die situation.
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i use a shim perry, to put feed in on top the frames, i have insulation on top the inner cover underneath the outer cover. jen, 40 degrees is a little chilly to be opening the hive, removing the lid completely. did you have the shim in place before now, or did you place it on when you put the fondant on?
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Perry, :) another first for me , I like the idea of putting the fondant right over the hole on the inner cover, but there were maybe 2-3 threads that said put it right on top of the frames. So I did it that way this time.
Hi Riv, such a mild winter so far, we've been in the fifties for quite awhile, so I didn't bother the bees. Now, rather suddenly, we are in the 30's day, and 20's at night. Forecast says no more warm days, so yesterday it went up to 40 and I jumped in there and got the job done.
Also, my bees are often out and about between 40-45 degrees, so I figures that they are pretty acclimated to these very cool days.
The hives look vulnerable cause I had to take the lid and inner cover off to put the feeding rim on and the fondant on, and a quick pic. I was in and out of the hives in less than a minute. I do know that it was risky at 40 degreeson .
But my original question was about the third hive, and having the bees all the way up and thru the top super and milling around on the top of the frames. Was wondering if this is a sign of them doing the chimney thing?
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Jen
you can do both ways it makes no difference. I like the shim better because I can get more fondant on top of the cluster. I also use a winter cover with an insulation board. I put fondant over the hole then I put my insulating board on top of fondant and put on the top cover. I prefer this way when its cold below 30. all I do is take off the top cover and pull off the insulating board and stick some fondant in and close up the hive, its take me about 20 seconds. The other way with shim takes me about 30 seconds. 40 degrees is cold to open your hive, its better to wait to you get 50 degrees. Don’t worry your bees will be fine. Left up the back end of your hives. If they feel heavy you don’t have to feed. Its good insurance to put some fondant in now.
http://www.brushymountainbeefarm.com/10-Frm-Wintering-Inner-Cover/productinfo/W671/
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Ray- "40 degrees is cold to open your hive, its better to wait to you get 50 degrees.
It's quite possible that we won't get another 50 degree day until maybe end of Feb ru
My rule of thumb is:
50 degrees, lift lid put in food, get the heck out of there.
55 degrees, can take lid off for awhile
60 degrees, can tear the hive down if needed
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Jen
who knows what kind of weather were going to get from now to the end of February. Sunday I might get a few hours of 50 degrees, and by the end of next week I could have 3' of snow and -20 degrees temp. Big arctic blast coming, Coldest temp of the season. I think 60 is to cold to tare a hive apart. I like 70. Work fast when you put fondant on now.
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Okay I will Ray, thanks!
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jen, i put a shim on top in the fall well before cold weather hits. i also heft my hives throughout cold weather to help me determine if i need to open them to add feed, but also know what is in there going into winter months.
any feed added, temp dependent. prefer 50 degrees to remove the insulated outer cover and just tip the inner cover enough to shove a winter patty in....i don't use fondant, but same concept applies. done very quickly.
at 40 degrees, i get in and get out. i don't take the inner cover completely off, just lift it enough to get the feed in. that's it.
below that, emergency, the inner cover is pried and tilted back and feed shoved in quickly. haven't had to do this for some time, but it can be done.
"my bees are often out and about between 40-45 degrees, so I figures that they are pretty acclimated to these very cool days."
if they are jen, they are taking cleansing flights, or the cluster has been disturbed. bees cluster at about 54-57degrees F. you don't want to disturb this cluster, and want to minimize any disturbance. bees will fly at all temps in defense of the hive, so try to minimize this as best you can, temperature, and prying off the outer/inner cover......be gentle.
with your shim on now, going forward, if you had to open hives that seem light in less desirable temperatures, below 50df, get in, get out, no time for pix......... :D
i guess what i am trying to say, think of this in terms of your front door or whatever door visitors use to enter your heated home. someone comes to visit, (welcome or not..... :D) and leaves the door open. heat escapes. if set at a temp, a furnace works to recover the heat loss from that room to bring it back to a certain temp......
and so the bees work to heat themselves in the cluster.
hope this made sense?
"my original question was about the third hive, and having the bees all the way up and thru the top super and milling around on the top of the frames. Was wondering if this is a sign of them doing the chimney thing?"
as far as the 3rd hive and the bees being already in the top? my guess is, there is nothing in the bottom deep, or if there is, maybe in the very outside frames. bees will move up and bees will cluster, or will extend a cluster to the tops of hive frames. your weather is different than mine. if you have frames of honey on either side of that cluster, your weather will most likely allow them to move from side to side to utilize those honey stores. if there are no honey stores on either side of them, putting the fondant on is good. whether there are honey stores on either side, placing fondant on or some type of winter feed is always a plus if needed....... ;)
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Thanks for the into Riv :) I have been hefting my 3 hives, so far they are not budging. But I do remember doing this very early this year, like late January-ish, and I did feel the difference of when the hive was starting to get lighter.
Curious... how often should I take a peek to see if more fondant is needed?
I think I am at my one year anniversary for joining this forum, I think it was within the first week of January. So last winter I knew nothing of hefting hives and winter feeding, Thanks for helping me along Sistah!
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Jen
who knows what kind of weather were going to get from now to the end of February. Sunday I might get a few hours of 50 degrees, and by the end of next week I could have 3' of snow and -20 degrees temp. Big arctic blast coming, Coldest temp of the season. I think 60 is to cold to tare a hive apart. I like 70. Work fast when you put fondant on now.
I open my nucs at 20 - 30° all the time to put sugar blocks/fondant on them. Doesn't seem to bother them at all.
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To me it's a do or let them die thing,if you do nothing, you end up with nothing, don't disturb them anymore than you have to, and be quick. JMHO. Jack
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update! Fondant half gone.
We've had such nice weather that I haven't peeked into the hive to see how the bees are doing with the fondant. We're having nice weather today, perfect for a super quick peek. To my amazement 2 of my 3 hives have gone half way thru their fondant, hundreds of bees covering the fondant. I put the fondant on about 10ish days ago.
I know what I'll be doing tomorrow :)
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The two hives that need more fondant... when I lifted the lids a little bit, there were hundreds of bees on the fondant, and on top of the frames. Not much space to put down another fondant pie. I don't use the pie tin, just the pie shaped fondant and wax paper. How do I get it on top of the frames with out mooshing a bunch of bees?
So, it will look like a mostly eaten fondant pie, and then additional fondant pie. Maybe cut it in half and put each half on either side of the half eaten fondant?
Should I use smoke to get them to go down? that would be a lot of time with the lid off...
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Couple puffs of smoke will scatter the bees around the frames. Put two pies together on top of each other. It will last longer.
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Update, 2 weeks later
On January 13, the fondant was half gone. Today, 3 more days later just a tiny bit left. That means that I will be feeding a cake of fondant every two weeks until spring. Good Grief
It was unusually warm today, no wind and so quiet, I stole a moment to put fondant into two of my hives. Bees haven't touched the fondant in hive 3.
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If they have capped honey you dont need to feed them fondant. The caveat here is that if the capped honey is ONLY around the outside of the edges and its wicked cold, then the fondant may be necessary. We are getting days in the mid 40's still.. by all comparison to last winter its a fantastic winter to be a bee.. They can move to reserves.. if I HAD reserves....
A little curious why your bees are at the top like that if they have capped honey below them? Cant see between the frames in the pictures, but I am definitely jealous of what I do see.. no, not the bees, talking about the green grass in the background, and hands with no gloves.. wait, no sleeve? Are you wearing a short sleeved shirt!!! :o
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Going to check mine Sunday and Monday, sunny and 60F both days :bee:. 50F's yesterday and the girls were trying to tell me something, they keep buzzing me while i was cutting wood. Jack
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-16 C = 3 F here today, that's our HIGH.
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Scott- paraphrasing Steve Harvey author of Act Like A Lady, Think Like A Man, some of his words of advice are:
Chapter four
“We need to talk.” For a man, few words are as menacing as those four — especially when a woman is the one saying them and he’s on the receiving end. Those four words can mean only two things to men: either we did something wrong or, worse, you really literally just want to talk.
Scott- "If they have capped honey you dont need to feed them fondant. The caveat here is that if the capped honey is ONLY around the outside of the edges and its wicked cold, then the fondant may be necessary. We are getting days in the mid 40's still.. by all comparison to last winter its a fantastic winter to be a bee.. They can move to reserves.. if I HAD reserves...."
Mkaaay, HOWEVER! I remember during late fall, and other posts as well, you saying that you go to the extent of covering any situation that winter may put upon the bees. So, you get all treatments done, then leave sugar cakes in all your hives 'Just In Case'. Then you close up the hive for winter assured that every winter scenario is covered. Then, if the sugar cakes are not used or some is left over, you make syrup out of them for spring feeding.
1. That's what I did, and knowing that the Farmer's Almanac said that we were going to have a mild winter, I did it anyway.
2. Between the drought and the ruby hummer syrup, the bees had a hard time making just enough honey for the winter, no reserves. And, I did take a couple or so frames of honey this year.
3. I rarely wear gloves, only when I've been in a hive too long do the bees get testy with my hands. I buff my hands and arms with my propolis tincture. I wear a ballcap with a head veil only.
4. "and hands with no gloves.. wait, no sleeve? Are you wearing a short sleeved shirt!!!
Actually, this winter has been so mild, that I'm practicing beekkeeping in the buff... you asked ;)
Okay Scott ~ You can talk now :D
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LOL I did ask didnt I.....
hehe.. Well, the reason I was speaking of the bees IN the top of your boxes eating the fondant, is that normally when I have capped honey above them, they dont GET to the fondant until the honey is all gone, so was wondering if hubby put some screws into the bottoms of the hive?? Your recalcitrant bees just like the fondant better than the capped honey??
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Recalcitrant!.... GOOD WORD! Pat yourself on the back for that one ;D We are word people in this house, and crossword puzzle workers.
As I look down into the super looking for honey, I haven't found a lack of yet. I see capped honey as far as I can see which is about an inch. But it hasn't been quite warm enough to pull up a frame or two or more. So I don't know what the deal is. One hive hasn't touched the fondant and the other two are gone in two weeks.
I wonder if it has anything to do with making this fondant with honey, per Ray's recipe.
PS. People in our neck of the woods are walking around in tshirts and tanks this last week. But we have been down into the 20's as well. Next week it might be sub zero, never know around here.
UPDATE: 3:27 and we hit 60 degrees. I'm sure that's a record for this time of year... Crazy
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jen, what honey stores, or frames of honey did you have going into your winter?
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Unusual weather for us this time of year,60F today, but a little to windy to open hives. The next two days to be in the sixties so i'll make a run to my outyards with newspaper and sugar, just in case. About those big words you'uns been using, it's cost me money :o, had to buy another paper back Dictionary, wore the other one out trying to see what you'uns are talking about. :D Jack