Worldwide Beekeeping
Beekeeping => Bee News => Topic started by: Ray on April 02, 2015, 08:45:12 am
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Anybody hear how the drought may effect the Almonds - Honey bees and us BeeKs?
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I haven't heard any news on that yet Ray, I know the trucks loaded with hives are on the freeways. We have had soo much rain very early. I do believe there is better news to date on nectar and pollen with the almonds so far. But, the fact that our spring happened so early leaves dought that there will be enough food for the bees later this summer when the drought kicks in again. In our direct area, we have Star Thistle for the end of summer feeding, which is drought tolerant. But, last year even the Star Thistle was barren of nectar.
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Hopefully this year will be better.
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Back Atcha Tbone, Texas was a dry waist land last year as well. Wishing you rain :)
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We had record rain last spring. I also had a couple of house floods. Rain isn't always such a good thing :'(
So what's the water plan for CA? Or is there a plan? I read someplace that Gov Brown was going to direct another billion toward water projects, but that sounded more like repairing city water lines rather than pumping in new water. I also read that Agriculture (and almonds in particular) use the vast majority of the water; something like 90%.
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Doing some reading: Water bottling might take a big hit. Hay is a large water consumer (bulky and hard to ship economically) so the Dairy industry is going to have problems.
I was wondering what kind of repercussions we might experience due to the drought. (for example) Will the big pollinators need to look East of the Rockies for nectar to top off their hives? Will that effect sugar and HFCS prices? Will that drive up pollination fees. Will that effect the package bees and queens?
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We've been listening for what's going to happen here in upper northern california. Seems we will be water rationed but not restricted. Many residents in our town just let their lawns go dormant last summer, us included. Most all of my plants and small trees are in wine barrels and watered about once a week.
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Some more news:
http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2015/apr/04/sacramento-drought-agriculture-california-water/
Water limits renew urban vs. rural debate
Here are some snips:
For example, it can take more than one gallon of water to produce a single almond.
The nonprofit called on the governor this week to place a moratorium on the use of groundwater on the west side of the San Joaquin Valley where water-intensive almond and pistachio groves are abundant
The governor doesn’t control the federal supplies of water, and doesn’t have the ability to monitor or enforce how much every farmer in the state takes out of the ground.
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For example, it can take more than one gallon of water to produce a single almond.
Wow!
What about drip systems for each almond tree. I mean, I know you have to have the water for a drip system, but doesn't that make sense?
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I'm sure there are a lot of things that COULD be done. In these days of ADVERSARIAL politics and SENSATIONALIZED news, I don't know if anything will be done. :sad:
The almond crop is gaining attention, as far as water use goes.
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Well I'm glad about that Ray, last year many almond growers here in Calif had to abandon their almond orchards because the water table got soo low. In southern Oregon it would be the pear orchards and vineyards.
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The drought here in the central valley is severe. The farmers are going to be able to pump water without restrictions only have to keep track of how much they pump. Jen all new orchards are drip irrigation.but there are farmers who still flood irrigate. The problem will be unable to make a profit farming fruits and vegetables so 700,000 acres will be fallowed maybe more. The farmers are still planting new almonds and nuts in areas that have never been farmed before. As far as bloom was very short and the bees came and went fast.The southern part of the valley is seeing a lot of wells going dry. I am on a list to get a new well drilled . So far i have plenty of water after lowering my pump last year.
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when I recently drove thru part of what I would call southern California on the way to and back from the ABF convention I though it looked like a lot of older vineyards and some citrus was being replaced by the planting of almond trees. Of course so much of the potential pollination business depends on the almonds and I for one am hoping and praying California record settling drought ends quickly. We had a severe drought here that ended back at the end of 2011 and it definitely made the keeping of animals and bees much more difficult.
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In several decades the wars won't be over oil, they will be over water or the lack thereof. Too bad I couldn't send you our rain from NY. Woke up in the middle of the night to a horrific storm. Wind blowing, hail slamming against the windows, thunder and lightening. This usually occurs in the summer around here not in April. Neighbor said her rain gauge recorded 2 inches!
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In several decades the wars won't be over oil, they will be over water or the lack thereof. Too bad I couldn't send you our rain from NY. Woke up in the middle of the night to a horrific storm. Wind blowing, hail slamming against the windows, thunder and lightening. This usually occurs in the summer around here not in April. Neighbor said her rain gauge recorded 2 inches!
Georgia has been fighting with Tennessee for several years now trying to move the state line so they can tap into the Tennessee River. Georgia, Alabama and Florida have been fighting over a river, too. So you're not going to have to wait decades, it's happening now. What's ironic is that the major cause of all of the problem is poor planning and overbuilding for the resources available.
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Hmmm, maybe too many human beings population Mother Earth?
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Les, I don't believe it will take several decades. I expect some sort of a dispute over the water in the Great Lakes.
I expect see a dam built across the Straits of Mackinaw. The only Great Lake totally in the USA. That would allow using the water in it, without International Issues.
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Ray, I hedged on the side of several decades. I truly agree that it will be sooner. Unfortunately, so many people do not understand the water crisis that is looming in the imminent future. Telling people they will have to curb their water usage will be a flash back to the seventies when we had the oil embargo. You could only obtain gas on either odd or even days depending on your license plate (or tag as they refer to it in some states). Unfortunately, most people are too young to remember the embargo days. We have a society now that is based on "I want it when I want it and to hades with other people". I worry :sad:
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I remember the embargo days Les, and I think that when we have to start rationing water it's going to be harder to deal with than fuel.
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I feel for CA, but does it really make any logical sense for the CA government to mandate a 25% reduction in human consumption of water (20% of supply) and no reductions for agricultural use? The Almond trees alone consume a trillion gallons of water; 20% more than the people use indoors! That's CRAZY in a dry place like CA. Can’t we grow Almonds in North Carolina or someplace on the East Coast with plenty of water?
Then there is the permanent damage occurring to the aquifers from subsidence. When the water is removed and not replaced, the land sinks and crushes the porosity of the rocks that can hold water. There’s no way to fix that.
Ray, we have a “Great Lakes Compact” signed into Law by the Government of Canada and our former fearless leader which should make it next to impossible to steal our water. As the Detroit Free Press reported, “Shipping Great Lakes water? That’s California Dreaming”
http://www.freep.com/story/news/local/2015/04/19/michigan-great-lakes-water/25965121/
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Logical, reducing 20% of the usage by 25%. That's reducing the total usage by 5% and hurting the most people the worst. Isn't that the normal government procedure? Why would you ever expect them to be ""LOGICAL"", logical? ;D
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Iddee is right.. but they ARE being logical in their own putrid way.. you cant infringe on the "money" so you take the water away from all the other users..
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Thanks for the link LogicalBee.
It's scary that it will take thousands of years for nature to repair the collapsed aquifers.
The possibility of no almond monoculture in California, and the effect that would have on the Honey Bee industry is why I started this thread. My crystal ball doesn't get that channel ;D , possibly Almonds Orchards will spring elsewhere in the USA or possibly they'll move offshore.
http://www.growpeanuts.com/where-do-almond-trees-grow.html
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What you people seem to need is water transportation from places with excess to places with shortage. We solved that with lots of connected waterways and water management programs. All our rivers, canals and creeks are connected trough pumps and locks. The problem you guys mostly have is distance and quantity needed..
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I really can't answer you vossejongk without starting a small war.
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Ray, I see in your link that Michigan has two Almond farms! Maybe we should start growing some ;D My water table is only 2 feet below the surface of the soil. Plenty of water here. I’ve looked into Walnut farming in the past since they grow like weeds in my area, but I don’t know of anybody around me that actually has an almond tree.
As for CA water woes, maybe Captain Kirk can solve the problem with his $30 billion dollar pipeline to Washington State; crowd funded of course. Maybe they can speed up the Transport using one of Elon Musk’s “hyperloops” along the way. ;D
http://www.latimes.com/opinion/topoftheticket/la-na-tt-shatner-boldly-goes-after-water-20150423-story.html
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Cali just needs to install a couple desalination plants. then they sell salt and HAVE fresh water..
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Desalination plants sure would help. Changing attitudes is what's necessary.
"You can always trust the Americans to do the right thing-after they have tried everything else". Winston Churchill
It's getting harder and harder to keep politics out of my comments.
I rather discuss beekeeping than argue politics. I rather discuss beekeeping than argue politics. I rather ......... ;D I feel better now.
Plenty of Black Walnut trees here also. My area is criss-crossed with county drains trying to keep the water table below ground. Malaria was a seasonal illness in Michigan before the drains were dug. Well, LogicalBee we wouldn't have to go very far for pollinators.
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Desalination isn’t cheap either. Looks like San Diego is spending 1billion dollars on a plant to desalinate 50 million gallons a day in 2016. Reverse Osmosis isn’t something the environmentalists are too fond of either since it increases the salinity of the ocean water around the plants. Might be bad for the turtles?
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/getting-clean-water-from-the-sea-at-a-high-price/
I believe Tampa Bay currently has the largest desalination plant in North America. Who would have thought that Tampa, of all places, needed more water! Needs 27,000 horsepower pumps for the process.
http://www.tampabaywater.org/tampa-bay-seawater-desalination-plant.aspx
My area is criss-crossed with county drains trying to keep the water table below ground. Malaria was a seasonal illness in Michigan before the drains were dug.
I complained to the county road commission that I needed some drainage on my property so what do they do? They came out and put a culvert under the road and now the fields across the road drain into my property! You just can't win :'( Didn't know that Malaria history trivia.
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They came out and put a culvert under the road and now the fields across the road drain into my property!
A can of expanding foam and any type of firearm fixes that. Toss can into culvert, try to get it in the middle... aim, fire...
Presto! No more water runs from culvert!
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There is probably a lot of room for finger pointing, as far as who wastes the most, but that won't solve the problem. Personally, I'd rather see someone wasting water producing food than rinsing off there driveway or watering there putting green lawn. When wells are going dry and people are waiting for their allotment of water, maybe it's time to move the almonds to Alabama. Just don't move them to China!
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Don't worry about China. The country is so polluted with pesticides that among most other insects, almost all bees have died out in a lot of areas. They do pollination mostly by hand (!) But for such a huge amount of almonds it's nearly impossible even for China with its huge workforce
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I’ve also seen the news reports about how polluted China is. I’ve never been there so I have no idea who much truth there is in the reports, but if we look at who’s producing the most honey in the world, it appears there are lots of bees in China.
(https://worldwidebeekeeping.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.planetexim.net%2FImages%2FHoney_Production_By_Country.png&hash=b063662511cfca9a11eb990b29115e0cbd901499)
Looks like the data was from 2009. Pretty surprised a country as large as the USA is WAY behind China in production. The report says the USA is actually the 2nd largest importer of honey. Hmmm, the taste of foreign pesticides in the morning…
Little hard to believe small places like Turkey and Ukraine out produced the USA in 2009.
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If You Think the Water Crisis Can't Get Worse, Wait Until the Aquifers Are Drained
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2014/08/140819-groundwater-california-drought-aquifers-hidden-crisis/
I've always trusted National Geographic, this article however should be read with dramatic music paying in the background. ;)
Almond Board of California
http://www.almonds.com/consumers/get-facts-about-almonds-and-water?gclid=CPGHyseslsUCFQEGaQodC1sARg
I bought a couple jars of pears (spartan brand) they were processed in China. I was eating out of the jar when i read that. Talk about the flavor changing in your mouth!
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Any new predictions on how the drought will effect us Beeks?
I see the Press is inciting the Politicians into producing larger quantities of hot air and a lot of finger pointing.
Did some googling and found this:
http://thinkprogress.org/climate/2015/05/05/3646965/california-drought-and-agriculture-explainer/
California’s Drought Could Upend America’s Entire Food System
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Drought usually means no or very few nectar, so for bees and beekeepers it means keeping a close eye on the honey/syrup reserves...
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Kansas is home to 22 million acres of soybeans, wheat, corn, alfalfa and sunflowers. In most of w esternKansas these crops are irrigated by the Ogallala Aquifer. The Ogallala is quickly being depleted as well. The old cottonwood trees, in western KS, whose roots tap into the aquifer are dying because the water table is too low. In school we were taught that Kansas is the breadbasket of America. They never told us it was done artificially. There is a reason that the tall grass prairie thrived in those conditions. The prairie grasses have amazing deep, deep roots.
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Here is an interesting article about a peach farmer.
Q&A Farmer David 'Mas' Masumoto's drought insight: Less water yields more flavorful peaches
http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-qa-peach-farmer-20150604-story.html
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What the above article posted by Ray did not address, is did the farmer earn enough money to live well? I hope he did. We have some local ranchers that live off the land. My area is full of small ranchers and farmers that earn their living from the soil, but the median income in our locale is less than 30 grand per year. Are any of you willing to farm and ranch for starvation wages? That is what many of our locals do.
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In the future we are going to have to protect are water rights from the government :o Here in Mo. they were wanting to charge for water use from your own well >:( never heard what became of that?) Instead of giving billions of our tax dollars to foreign country's why don't they build more reservoir's to prepare for drought. Of course this would create jobs and possibly using american made steel and other american made products, and our great leaders don't want any of that. :o I'm done, sorry for the rant. Jack
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I know that up here (more on the west coast when I lived there) there was a lot of worry about NAFTA, and the impact it could have on the fresh water we have up here.
I saw pictures of these massive water bladders, they looked like zeplins, being floated down the rivers to head south for sale. Having cities exist where they normally couldn't comes at a price.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flexible_barge