what are they thinking?

[neillsayers]

This has me scratching my head.

https://www.beeculture.com/catch-the-buzz-bee-removal-to-be-illegal-in-texas/?utm_source=Catch+The+Buzz&utm_campaign=965478b193-Catch_The_Buzz_4_29_2015&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_0272f190ab-965478b193-320254657

[Lburou]

Those requirements are very surprising to me.  One more time when the man says, "I'm here from the government to help you."  :-/

[neillsayers]

I looked into a bit more on the internet and evidently it has already died in process, so hopefully it won't come up again.

[Lburou]

I looked into a bit more on the internet and evidently it has already died in process, so hopefully it won't come up again.

I hope you the report is correct!

[tecumseh]

a Lee snip..."I'm here from the government to help you."  :-/

might I suggests.. the next time that phrase runs thru your head do remember you are/were from the government.... at least here so are the fireman, police officers and for that matter the folks that supply us with water and electric...  I guess some folks will repeat any silly phrase without much thought. Sadly the person that coined the phrase was at the top of the government hierarchy which I guess does tell you something about him!

As to the bill this is now dead on arrival.  Likely not such a bad idea to have some kind of requirements for folks who cut into folks house and remove bees.  Sadly brought forth by one of the lamest beekeeping people in Texas. He has a 'real' reputation over around Austin and I suspect the his secondary agenda item was to limit the folks who do this and to give him some free labor in the process.... I think in his mind he had the idea that he would do the training and therefore also tap into some government money... In the whole process no one even calculated the cost of putting on the training... Which I guess should tell you something about how our legislature thinks.... or not! 

[Lburou]

...As to the bill this is now dead on arrival.  Likely not such a bad idea to have some kind of requirements for folks who cut into folks house and remove bees.  Sadly brought forth by one of the lamest beekeeping people in Texas. He has a 'real' reputation over around Austin and I suspect the his secondary agenda item was to limit the folks who do this and to give him some free labor in the process.... I think in his mind he had the idea that he would do the training and therefore also tap into some government money... In the whole process no one even calculated the cost of putting on the training... Which I guess should tell you something about how our legislature thinks.... or not! 

Gene, I used that well known phrase in the same vein as it's originator, (for humor).  When the military (my former profession) arrives for civilian disasters, they are usually welcomed.  That is in contrast to the arrival of a visitor from a regulatory branch of government.      

There are however, times when a government can be out of touch with the electorate and/or the reality of most of the governed. This was one of those times.  (Moderators, I do not intend to start something political here.) This latest amalgamation of proposals seemed to be coming from several directions. Some, I thought, could be a good thing. 

I appreciate the background on the likely source requiring training & licencing for takeouts Gene, we agree on the unsuitability of this bill. Thanks. 

[iddee]

Lee, government talk is OK now. Just don't let it get party specific, or me or Tec will disagree with you. We never agree on party items, but do agree on a lot of government stuff.

[tecumseh]

nicely said iddee... basically I tend to be anti all parties basically because it now requires tribal thinking and labeling others... I basically believe the folks like iddee and myself may disagree on this or that but in 96% of things we agree. Folks that have an agenda want to highlight the 4% and convince both of us to forget the 96%.

To somewhat quote Molly Ivans... 'the citizens of Texas and never so in danger as when the leg (legislature) is in succession...'

When this legislation came to my attention I went to the TAIS (Texas Apiary Inspection Service... ie the folks charged with enforcing bee laws in Texas) and ask them first 2 question and then a follow up 3rd question.  1) What do you think of the idea? and 2) How much would a course of 160 hours cost?  The third question was had anyone from the legislature contact you concerning the practicality and cost of implementing the bill?

Not so unexpectedly the answer to question 3 was NO which reinforces the idea that a lot of folks in Texas think they know much more than they do and that expert advice from those folks charged with enforcing the law is NOT important. 

A lot of folks now do this service with no insurance and with little or no experience in structure, remodeling or the building trades... so we are only one incident away from some knee jerk reaction after someone burns someone's house down or kills some child walking down the street when they get stung to death by agitated bees.   then EXPECT regulation to include extensive training and liability insurance that no one can afford.. The state does has a reputation of NOT enforcing the existing laws on the books which somewhat legitimizes the high liability cost.

Of course with all the weepy eyed feeling for the bees a number of folks have exploited the situation and basically ripped off their customers... <the fellow who lives in Austin and brought forth the legislation tell folks he will remove the bees for free and then send the same folks a bill and threatens to file the bill as a workman's lien at the country court house if they do not pay.  He has (at last report) several suits filed against him for various reasons...

[Lburou]

nicely said iddee... basically I tend to be anti all parties basically because it now requires tribal thinking and labeling others...

Yes, I've seen Gene throw barbs equally at all sides.  Philosophers and comedians have a gift to show us how/who we really are, Gene is somewhere in that mix.   

If I had input to a proposed future State Inspection Bill, I would ask that the TAIS publish a brief report each year reporting:  1) Number of hives actually inspected, 2) Inspections per county, 3) Number of confirmed cases, (by county), of AFB and other diseases deemed important to beekeepers,  4)  Trends in honey bee health discovered by the TAIS.  Bee-L has been discussing state inspections, and many of the  reports reveal a reticence on the part of Inspectors to reveal numbers of AFB cases and locations in a given State.  I don't want to know much detail, but a report by county could be helpful.

P.S.  In my native State of Wyoming, I could register as an independent voter.  All States should allow that.  It keeps parties from assuming my support and speaking for me but actually advancing their own agendas.

[Wandering Man]

We only have three inspectors for the whole state, don't we?  The last time I looked on the map, Texas seemed to be pretty big.

How would (or do) they managed to do the inspections, anyway?

[tecumseh]

well now WanderingMan now 4.  But yes the state is large and most of the inspectors (excluding Bill) are young... including the head of the group (Mary).  the age exception is Bill who is always a joy to deal with and he brings a lot of historical understanding to the Inspection Service < he is always a good source when you want to know the why or when of a particular bee law.

They do inspection* for not only the migratory group and those that are home grown and participate in the pollination business but also a lot of the folks that do removals (you do need a permit for that) + if you wish to be listed on their web site as a remover you need to apply for an intrastate permit which allows you to move bees across county lines < cost is $35. As might be expected... their is even whinning about the intrastate permit by some small group of anarchist no regulation beekeepers... 

The inspection service also operates the Texas Master Beekeeper's program which is (to my understanding) the same program developed in Florida and the group does this task beyond their official 'legal' mandate. Their legal mandate is to enforce the bee laws in Texas (they essentially have the same legal authority as any law enforcement officer) but they have no mandated to do education or extension work.  Consequently the  Master's Beekeeping Program and every talks they give is above and beyond the call of duty.

*IMHO..... Many state now have NO inspection service and these have or will become dumping grounds for large number of bees by folks (not all but some) who have no problem operating outside the boundary of any ethical or moral code.  In places like Texas my largest threat in this 'set down beekeeping operation' is from folks bring stuff here from one of the coast.
   

[tecumseh]

a Lee snip..
If I had input to a proposed future State Inspection Bill, I would ask that the TAIS publish a brief report each year reporting:  1) Number of hives actually inspected, 2) Inspections per county, 3) Number of confirmed cases, (by county), of AFB and other diseases deemed important to beekeepers,  4)  Trends in honey bee health discovered by the TAIS.  Bee-L has been discussing state inspections, and many of the  reports reveal a reticence on the part of Inspectors to reveal numbers of AFB cases and locations in a given State.  I don't want to know much detail, but a report by county could be helpful.

Lee I will pass this on to Mary... I suspect # 1 and 2 would not be that difficult to obtain and should be available now as a public information document. #3 might be more difficult although certainly any incident of AFB would be something any local beekeeper should want to know < and yes like many states their does seem to be 'hot spots' where this very serious problem still occurs. #4 I am not certain what that means?

[Lburou]

...#4 I am not certain what that means?

Anytime TAIS has information about a new pest, parasite, infective disease, or treatment, I'd appreciate a heads up.  The main thing is sharing about AFB hot spots.  Thanks for bringing this up with Mary. 

[tecumseh]

Mary Reed (she and I also share the same undergraduate institution... ie the University of Florida) puts out a email from time to time Lee.  This typically include information about large spraying events about to happen (either for mosquitos or for cotton) and sometimes about surveys related to BIP.  I am not certain how you get on her list but I will check on the also.