Swarm Fun! Not really!

[tbonekel]

Yesterday, when my wife was leaving the house, she texted me from the road and said, "hey, check out the bees!"  I went out and sure enough, I had a swarm in the air. I'm sure they were from one of my hives, but don't know which one. They landed in a tree about 15 feet up and I had to maneuver around a bunch of other limbs, but with my trusty bucket, I got them. I didn't see the queen and it took probably 10 times to keep them from settling back on the limb. They finally started fanning at the entrance to the box I was dumping them in and those in the air started flying toward the box. Success! So I thought. I didn't have time to give them any brood to keep them busy or any feed, so I just put empty foundation in, closed them up and decided to wait until today.

Today, as I am coming home from work I see lots of bees in the air. I was hoping that it wasn't another swarm from another hive.  It wasn't. The bees from yesterday decided they didn't like the box. They landed on a limb this time, lower to the ground and it was easier to get them. I still never saw a queen, but now, I placed a queen excluder above the bottom board, a frame feeder with sugar water and an entrance reducer to keep robbers away. This is not a big swarm and I really think I should have seen the queen, but didn't.

Now for the questions. Have you ever caught a queen less swarm? If they had a queen yesterday and maybe was killed in my many bucket attempts, would they still abscond in swarm like fashion from a box?

[iddee]

Opinion only, not fact.....

She has slimmed down enough for you to miss her. She may have also slimmed down enough to go through the excluder. Keep your fingers crossed.

[tbonekel]

Good point. And the thought of a virgin queen crossed my mind.

[Perry]

I wonder if a frame of open brood might hold them?

[Jen]

And now we wait 

[Riverrat]

Most generally if a swarm issues without the queen. They will return to the hive shortly after balling up and reissue the next day.

[Les]

Riverrat,  could you explain your explanation in plain old newbie language?

[Garden Hive]

Just some observations....
Just recently, a keep that I have been assisting called in a panic "Bee's swarming" !
They watched them circle and rise maybe 50'-60' around a tree. Saw them start to settle on a limb then right back down to the hive and gathered thick on the blocks that the hive was on. 3 hrs later I arrived. They were all back inside. Found her and removed her and a nuc. Left behind plenty of opportunities (eggs) for the remaining and 2 capped swarm cells. Had plenty of room (1 full capped super,1 mostly filled but not capped, 1 barely touched empty foundation super)  but instead of drawing fresh comb they were busy filling all of the brood comb. Maybe now they produce a large volume of excess honey.

So you wonder why they leave the original colony a mess to clean-up. Just when you think.....awe heck just go with it!
It's All FUN !!
Tim

[Jen]

Exactly Garden! That happened to me right before my eyes last year. I was standing in the middle of the swarm and loving it as usual, waiting for them to land. They made a few loops in the sky and came right back down on the the hive like a big blanket. It was really Cool! Well, except 4 days later they did it again and succeeded  but I caught them anyway 

[tbonekel]

A little update on this interesting situation: I caught these bees for the second time on June 3rd and placed them in a box. On June 4th, the next day, I looked out late afternoon and the sky was filled with bees. I haven't see many swarms in action so I might not know one, but this seemed different. It seemed more random and the activity was all over the yard and I mean everywhere. My AC unit is about 25-30 feet from my hives and bees were flying into it, hitting the fan blades probably 2-3 bees every 5 seconds. I looked at the new hive and there were a ton of bees flying around the entrance. My first thought was not swarming, but robbing. I just decided to let it happen and after about 10 minutes, all was calm again. As of yesterday, the 6th, there are bees still in the box and about half of the original sugar syrup is still there. I haven't had a chance to go in to see if they have started any work, but this has been a head scratcher.

[Jen]

Could they have attempted a swarm and found that that queen was not air born with them, then they returned to the hive?

[tbonekel]

That could be it. I do have an excluder on. Thanks! I hadn't thought of that possibility.

[tbonekel]

So went in this hive today and found a queen! I have a frame feeder in the hive and they are drawing slowly. I saw eggs in half drawn cells.  There is not that many bees, so I shook some bees in from another hive to help build. Jen, I think you are right about them trying to swarm but couldn't because the excluder was keeping the queen in. I wonder how long I should leave it in?

[riverbee]

my two cents?
get rid of the queen excluder........
that's just me, others may have different thoughts on this tbone, but i would remove it.

[rober]

I've (supposedly ) done everything right: gave them a frame of honey, a frame of brood, a frame of nectar plenty of drawn comb for the queen to lay in, & put in a few drops of lemon grass oil to sweeten the deal. the next morning-gone!. the hives quits feeding the queen to slim her down so she can fly & secondary swarms often have a virgin queen so an excluder is no guarantee. I now do all of the above mentioned enticements, install a screened migratory cover instead of an inner cover, & lock them down for 2-3 days. haven't had a swarm leave since.