How far do you need to move Nuc's to start a Hive?

[PappyRick]

In Beekeeping Class I learned that you either need to move a hive 2 feet or 2 miles.  I figured out today that my current proposed location (and only option at this point) is 1.06 miles from my Nuc's supplier's location.  Is this a problem?  Or should I consider a different supplier for my Nuc's?  Opinions required.

[Wandering Man]

My (limited) understanding is that if the bees are foraging in the same area where the nuc originated, they will tend to go back to the original site.

If you have a seller that you trust, and who's bees have qualities you think are desirable, you might ask the seller if he has a bee yard located more than two miles away from either his site or your site.  You could leave them there for the recommended time, and then bring them to the site you have in mind.

[Perry]

When you move the nuc to your property and hive them in your equipment, make sure to put a bunch of branches or some scrub brush semi-blocking the entrance. What you are trying to accomplish is to force the bees wanting to exit to realize that something is completely different with their setting. As they finally maneuver their way out, most will immediately re-orient to find out what happened. After a couple of days you can remove the obstacle.
I'm not saying you won't lose any bees, but for certain a lot less.

[CBT]

Like Perry said once they figure out something is different they retune their GPS for home base

[riverbee]

"In Beekeeping Class I learned that you either need to move a hive 2 feet or 2 miles.  I figured out today that my current proposed location (and only option at this point) is 1.06 miles from my Nuc's supplier's location.  Is this a problem?  Or should I consider a different supplier for my Nuc's?  Opinions required."

paw-paw, when i move a hive, it's usually a single deep divide or a 5 frame nuc. i move these 2 to 3 miles away. also, i have the luxury of moving a further distance of 90 miles.

if your supplier of a nuc is only a mile away, i wouldn't be too concerned. IF the nuc is established and the queen is laying. i have never used branches or anything, except to remove the moving screen and placed that on the landing board of single deep. works for me.
if the nuc isn't established, meaning bees and frames and a queen thrown in............different circumstance.  bees will be confused wherever they land. i have done divides in nucs and left them in the same yard. just made sure they could defend themselves.
i think we don't give credit to bees as to where 'home' is.........cause my observation and experience is they remember the last place they were or came from. perhaps adding branches and such gives them one more 'gps'.

ya don't need a different supplier...........

[PappyRick]

Thanks guys.  I appreciate the input.  Wandering Man,  I like the option of asking him to relocate the Nuc to another spot in the area more than 2 miles from my site and his home. I know the supplier has a bunch of hives around the area.  Riverbee is probably right.  Based on my research to this point, I agree bees are probably a lot smarter than I am giving them credit.  I am expecting and hoping they will be smart enough to overcome some (or all) of my miscues.  I think if I can get my supplier to relocate, I will be more comfortable. 

Riverbee, you bring up an item that I have been concerned about, but don't know how to do, and that is "just made sure they could defend themselves".  I figure my location is in the middle of a commercial bee yard, so for the first month or so, I'm gonna be worried every time I make the trip out there that my hives have been robbed.  Any advice on defense.

PappyRick

[Wandering Man]

You can make or buy a robber screen.

http://cookevillebeekeepers.com/06/how-to-make-a-simple-robber-screen

http://www.betterbee.com/wooden-hive-kits-10-frame/rs10-robber-screen-wooden.asp?mkwid=s&pcrid=178685257679&pkw=&pmt=&pdv=t&gclid=CjwKEAjwtbPGBRDhoLaqn6HknWsSJABR-o5sqOOxHlGlDjdHKmOABbCv5XdT89Dc9cyZpsebZiEqpBoCHSDw_wcB

[PappyRick]

Thanks for that Wandering Man.  I will be placing my hive in an area that has quite a few hives.  I figure my hive will be at risk.  Had not seen a robber screen at any of the supplier outlets.  I will probably put some of my scrap wood to use.  Thanks.

PappyRick

[riverbee]

"Riverbee, you bring up an item that I have been concerned about, but don't know how to do, and that is "just made sure they could defend themselves".  I figure my location is in the middle of a commercial bee yard, so for the first month or so, I'm gonna be worried every time I make the trip out there that my hives have been robbed.  Any advice on defense."

entrance reducer. use an entrance reducer. robbing screens also work great.
when i create nucs or buy nucs, (usually in the spring) i use the smallest opening on an E/R. if i have done a divide in a deep box, i move it and also a nuc created from my own hives, and again use the smallest opening. as they grow, i open the E/R.  package bees the same. haven't done package bees in sometime but always started off in a deep hive and E/R at the smallest opening.  when to open up a little more? when you see 'traffic jams' at the front as they build up and grow.  i have only used robbing screens in a dearth, stronger hives robbing weaker hives, and also if i think i might have a problem when i take honey off in the fall.  sometimes i have just popped the lid off (outer cover/inner cover) all the hives or strongest hives when robbing was occurring to try and isolate the robbers, and when i figured it out the stronger hives received the robbing screens. sometimes all hives received a robbing screen. for the bigger hives it slows them down and for the smaller/weaker hives, more defense. 

this is and can be regional and weather/ nectar source related, or how close you are to another beek,  and how many hives one keeps.  there are so many variables on what we can get away with when dividing hives, creating nucs, hiving packaged bees and also depends on how many hives you have, how strong they are, are we feeding or not to leave them in the same yard with bigger stronger hives.  i have learned for myself to move my nucs. (i normally keep about 6 or 7 hives now). sometimes i can get away with leaving a divided deep as long as there is a good nectar flow. if there is not i move out.
i am rambling..........
best bet is to use an entrance reducer, smallest opening, and be observant pappyrick!
if you see bees flying all over the nuc/hive up and down looking for a place to get in, and fighting bees on the landing board, sure sign of robbing. it's sort of frantic flying behavior and much different than bees that are in flight or first flight and orienting to the hive.
hope this helps.

[PappyRick]

Hey guys.  Thought I would give you an update on my hives.  The supplier does indeed have a bee yard that will be further than 2 miles from his location or my proposed location, and has agreed that he will move the Nuc there for a week or so.  Bees should be ready sometime early (first week) in April.  Everything is budding out, and I am getting impatient.  Can't wait to get started - I am SO stoked!!!!

[riverbee]

very cool!

[CBT]

Different stokes for different folks

[Jen]

Read thru this thread. Good thread.

Let me verify a couple of things here 

I can make a nuc out of a split. Or several nucs from queen cells from a swarm. And keep the nucs in the same bee yard, as long as entrance reducers or robbing screens are used?

And, if I had a place to move my new nucs too, how long do those nucs have to be away from my bee yard, before I can bring them back?

[Lburou]

...Let me verify a couple of things here 

I can make a nuc out of a split. Or several nucs from queen cells from a swarm. And keep the nucs in the same bee yard, as long as entrance reducers or robbing screens are used?

And, if I had a place to move my new nucs too, how long do those nucs have to be away from my bee yard, before I can bring them back?

You can do those things Jen, but the outcome can vary a great deal.  The nurse bees on the frames you split or divide will stay on those frames and in their new home with no problem.  It is the foragers who have been out of the hive and oriented to their old location that present a challenge.

Those foragers will leave their new home, forage, and go back to their old hive location unless you can get them to reorient to the new location you have chosen for them.  That brings us to what Perry recommended:

...What you are trying to accomplish is to force the bees wanting to exit to realize that something is completely different with their setting. As they finally maneuver their way out, most will immediately re-orient...

A piece of plywood works pretty well to alter their flight path and force them to reorient.  Always do as riverbee recommends & use a small entrance and robbing screens until the hive is robust enough to defend itself.  Be careful not to spill any sugar syrup around the new hives as you feed them (that will cause a robbing event).

A week should be long enough at another location before bringing them back home.  JMO