Brood box setup

[SmokeyBee]

Hello again-

Brief background:

I'm a first year beginner... Started with a package of bees on March 18th. I'm in South Carolina where its currently 90 degrees.

I have only recently realized that the "standard" for brood boxes is two deeps or three mediums. I started with a deep, let it get 80% drawn, then put on a medium. About halfway through the medium box getting drawn out, they stopped taking feed. The medium got to about 80% drawn and I've added another medium, that was about two weeks ago.

I know that I'm not supposed to expect honey the first season with undrawn frames, but until I realized my mistake with the wrong box size, I was thinking of the second medium as a super. Right now all of the brood is in the deep and the first medium. The second medium is only beginning to get drawn out with some small amount of uncapped honey.

My understanding (which could be wrong) is that the honey in the brood boxes is for the bees and everything above that is for me (right?). However, with me using the "wrong" setup, I'm thinking that I shouldn't try to harvest the second medium and leave it for the winter bees. On the other hand, we have very mild winters here and maybe a deep and one medium is enough.

Thoughts?

[Perry]

This is one of those "local" questions so I am hesitant to answer. My gut tells me that a deep and a medium "should" be OK, but I will defer to those who are in your area.

[riverbee]

"I'm a first year beginner... Started with a package of bees on March 18th. I'm in South Carolina where its currently 90 degrees.

I have only recently realized that the "standard" for brood boxes is two deeps or three mediums. I started with a deep, let it get 80% drawn, then put on a medium. About halfway through the medium box getting drawn out, they stopped taking feed. The medium got to about 80% drawn and I've added another medium, that was about two weeks ago.

I know that I'm not supposed to expect honey the first season with undrawn frames, but until I realized my mistake with the wrong box size, I was thinking of the second medium as a super. Right now all of the brood is in the deep and the first medium. The second medium is only beginning to get drawn out with some small amount of uncapped honey.

My understanding (which could be wrong) is that the honey in the brood boxes is for the bees and everything above that is for me (right?). However, with me using the "wrong" setup, I'm thinking that I shouldn't try to harvest the second medium and leave it for the winter bees. On the other hand, we have very mild winters here and maybe a deep and one medium is enough.

Thoughts?"

smokey bee..

there is no wrong box size or set up, it's what works for you........ and standard? standard really is what works for each of us in our locations and what we use for equipment and what we need to overwinter bees.  in your area as perry said, find out locally what most use, i would guess a deep and a medium would be sufficient? the second medium? again this is a question for your local area as to what the bees need to survive during winter months. 

[yes2matt]

Well, I'm in Charlotte NC which is closer (a little).  Lots of folks here do like you describe, a deep and a medium brood box. My strongest hive is set up that way, but I use an excluder to keep the queen out of the third box, the girls leave an arc in the bottom of those middle frames like they expect her to move up there.

To overwinter that configuration,  make sure it's full of honey. It's good in spring because you can checkerboard  (google Walt Wright) the first super with another medium of comb. It's sometimes a pain in the neck to swap frames or make splits with mediums in deep boxes or whatnot.

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[SmokeyBee]

Thanks for the information.  I'm outside of Columbia ("famously hot), so we're about 5 degrees warmer than Charlotte year round.

Matt- what configuration are your other hives?

[yes2matt]

Thanks for the information.  I'm outside of Columbia ("famously hot), so we're about 5 degrees warmer than Charlotte year round.

Matt- what configuration are your other hives?

Hahaha that's a funny question.

I'm only a year ahead of you. I started with a 8fr medium hive. Not big enough for me. I'd like to have double deeps, with medium supers.  So this year's project is to get them off the medium combs into the deep boxes nd built up to start next year strong and clean foundation in the medium frames. It's a work in progress. This is my "back line" it has a 5fr nuc, a deep+med, another deep+med, my old 8fr box with some bees maybe raising a queen and a young colony in the closest deep. So yeah, I've got a mess.

[SmokeyBee]

If the bees are happy, I guess its not a mess.

I just checked mine today...three frames in the "super" half filled with uncapped honey. Its not even June yet! Either I have really good bees or I'm just lucky. Started on new foundation with a package and I never thought it would get this far this year.

[yes2matt]

Well maybe seeing my mess will make you feel better about your "wrong box size" "mistake"  hahaha

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[Green bee]

Here in nc I've been told by several beeks it's not a problem overwintering with one deep and two med. that's how I am going. Hope this helps.

[SmokeyBee]

***UPDATE***

Its now been a month since I put the third box on. I'm not using a queen excluder.

I looked in the top medium today and it 95% drawn out! Wow, they really got ahead of me. My plan ( now ever changing) was to treat this like a super and harvest any capped honey that I could, even if it was only a couple of frames at a shot, then put the frames back in and let the bees refill them. The bees are apparently not on board with this "plan".

The bees have continued to expand the brood nest into this upper box. The center frames have big footballs of capped brood wit capped honey at the top and pollen margins. The two outer frames are the only ones without brood and that honey is uncapped.

I'm considering harvesting the two outer frames once they're capped. My concern is that the hive is getting crowded and they might swarm. It is absolutely stuffed with bees and there are 5-6 frames of capped brood in the top box alone.

Should I add another medium? Other options?

[yes2matt]

What do the bottom frames look like

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[SmokeyBee]

Haven't dug into the two bottom boxes in a bit. They're drawn out 100% but I don't know what's in the cells.

Just picked up another medium today, just needs a coat of paint.

[tecumseh]

a story and a half is pretty standard make up for bees kept in the southern US.  in some older books the bottom box is called 'the brood chamber' and the upper box is 'the food chamber'.  a medium box full will get most bees thru till spring time when depending on brooding rate you may then have to feed (or not).

most of mine look much like the above picture... that is a jumble of sizes and as far as I can tell the girls seems not to care.

personally I think everyone should take just a taste in year one just to see what they have been missing... but do NOT take too much.

I think SmokeyBee the folks are warning you against the idea they without some data the bottom box may well be totally empty (that is the bees move upwards and will quite often leave the bottom box totally empty).  I can determine this by simply tipping the hive and if the unit feels top heavy then the bottom box is most often empty.  Left in this circumstance the hive is subject to predation by wax moth and small hive beetle...  the proper manipulation to remedy this situation is 'reversing'.

and how much for that dog? 

[SmokeyBee]

Well I was able to get into the hive again today with every intention of reversing the boxes as suggested by Tecumseh. By the time I got both mediums off, the bees were letting me know that they were getting tired of my poking around.

They have not moved up, just expanded. The bottom deep was STUFFED with bees. Most of the deep  frames were honey (only peeked down in there, they were getting mad) with some capped brood, including drones.

I put it back together and hope to get this new box painted today.

Should I just keep stacking? How high is "too high" for a hive?

[SmokeyBee]

Also, the dog's not for sale, haha...who would chase my squirrels if he were gone?

[riverbee]

"Well I was able to get into the hive again today with every intention of reversing the boxes as suggested by Tecumseh. By the time I got both mediums off, the bees were letting me know that they were getting tired of my poking around.
They have not moved up, just expanded. The bottom deep was STUFFED with bees. Most of the deep  frames were honey (only peeked down in there, they were getting mad) with some capped brood, including drones.
I put it back together and hope to get this new box painted today.
Should I just keep stacking? How high is "too high" for a hive?"

that's cool you didn't have to reverse.............if they haven't moved up and the bottom deep is stuffed and they are expanding.............add another box!