Hot Hive Heading into Winter

[The15thMember]

Some of you may remember that nasty hive I posted about a little while ago, the one I was working when I hurt my back.  I've let them sit undisturbed for several weeks, and yesterday I worked the hive next to them, just to sort of see what kind of a mood they'd be in with a little bit of disruption.  It wasn't terrible, but I did have a few bees from the nasty hive bumping me and trying to get at my wrists.  Then after I was done and went back in the house, my little sisters were tossing a softball in the driveway, and they got chased by several bees, and my youngest sister was stung on the eyebrow.  This is now the second time something like this has happened, so I've obviously got to do something about this hive.  It's too late to requeen without buying a mated queen, which I'm not going to do.  I'm kicking around a couple of options. 

Option A: I switch the positions of this hive and my weakest hive.  This will strengthen the weak hive and weaken the strong mean one, hopefully to the point that it becomes a little more manageable.  The potential issue with this is my weak hive is the one most exposed to foot traffic, so I'm concerned that moving the mean hive to that stand will expose more people to angry bees. 

Option B: I do very a crude walk-away split, where I basically set the top two boxes of the mean hive on another stand.  I then see which half of the split has the queen, and the side that doesn't, I combine with my weak hive.  This way the hot hive will be small enough that they will hopefully settle down.  This plan still requires me to lace the weak hive, which is exposed to foot traffic, with mean bees, who may or may not immediately calm down. 

Option C: I do the split plan, but only to make finding the queen easier.  Once I find her I kill her, and then I basically break up the mean hive, and distribute its resources throughout the whole apiary, hoping to water down the mean ones in all the other nice bees.  I would still give more resources to the weak hive, since they are most in need, but I wouldn't give them a ton of adult bees. 

Option D: I give some of the mean hive's resources to the weak hive, and I then feed the mean hive.  Based on the fact that this hive wasn't a problem until fall hit, I'm wondering if they are just really reactive to the nectar dearth we are experiencing now.  Perhaps if I just simulate a flow for them, they'll settle down.  The risk with this is I only have about a month of liquid feeding/inspecting weather left, so if they turn mean again the instant I turn their artificial tap off, I've then made my bed, and I'm going to have to lie in it all winter, and I'm not keen on having to pop open the top to check them and being bombarded every time.   
     
Which option do you think is best?  Does anyone have a better idea I haven't thought of?  Perhaps a combination of the options is better than any one?  What are your thoughts?

[Zweefer]

Not knowing your weather, I’ll defer to @iddee. Where I’m at I have a month tops left before I can’t do anything with them at all.

[Bakersdozen]

For what it is worth I would split that hive up while there is time.  You will probably find that the workers will become more docile without her presence.  Then find the queen and dethrone her.  Combine those resources with other colonies, especially your weak colony.  You can always do splits again in the spring.  I have divided up weak colonies in the fall by splitting brood boxes apart and placing whole brood boxes on top of other colonies using the newspaper method.  That meant 3 brood boxes going into winter.  In the spring, while reversing brood boxes I removed one box and reduced the colony back down to two brood boxes.

[Gypsi]

I would split it. Bakersdozen has definitely got a good plan. Take your losses in the fall, give the resources to the rest of your apiary.

[Jen]

Hi 15th, lots of reading here. All sounds feasible. Keep in mind that if you split, the bees in the split are going to want to go back to the original location, which will in turn leave the split weakened. So think about moving the split a couple of miles away. Or, I have a big backyard and have had success with moving a split to the other side of my yard with the entrance facing the opposite direction. And I fold or staple #8 hardware cloth on the the entrance and leave them in there for 2-3 days, then remove the #8 and add some twigs or I use couple of small lemon size rocks on the entrance so the bees can reorient. I think you already know this, just new info for new beeks 

As Baker said, I also like the newspaper combines.

[The15thMember]

For what it is worth I would split that hive up while there is time.  You will probably find that the workers will become more docile without her presence.  Then find the queen and dethrone her.  Combine those resources with other colonies, especially your weak colony.  You can always do splits again in the spring.  I have divided up weak colonies in the fall by splitting brood boxes apart and placing whole brood boxes on top of other colonies using the newspaper method.  That meant 3 brood boxes going into winter.  In the spring, while reversing brood boxes I removed one box and reduced the colony back down to two brood boxes.

@Bakersdozen Your post has given me an idea.  I'm a little worried about moving mean bees into a nice hive by any method for fear of accidentally making two mean hives instead of one.  So here's what I'm thinking.  The dilemma really comes down to whether or not the workers' aggression is being caused by the queen pheromone or not.  Obviously if it's genetic, then moving the workers into other hives won't help, it will only make the other hives aggressive.  If it's the queen pheromone, then would it be correct to assume that if I split the colony, the half without the queen could get calmer?  Obviously queenlessness is a stress, so this is experiment won't really tell me anything if the queenless half is still upset, but if they are calm, that would indicate to me that I could probably combine them with another hive without a problem.  I'm thinking that I'll just break them into two halves for a few days and see whether or not the queenless half calms down.  If they do, then I'll kill the queen and combine this hive with my weak one.  If they don't, then I'll put this hive by itself at the end of the apiary and wait until spring to requeen.  What do you think?

[Gypsi]

it's not the pheromone it's the DNA.  However dilute and conquer.   If there is no flow you need to be feeding anyway, putting up stores will occupy part of them

[The15thMember]

it's not the pheromone it's the DNA.  However dilute and conquer.   If there is no flow you need to be feeding anyway, putting up stores will occupy part of them

This hive has plenty of honey, they don't need feeding unless I take some stores from them, which I think I will since I've got a weak hive in need, and this hive which could use some busy work. 

I guess it's a question of whether my experiment is really going to tell me anything meaningful and if it's worth the extra work.  Perhaps the easiest thing to do is just put them by themselves at the far end of the apiary and leave them as much alone as possible until spring.