Author Topic: Package Bees Dead after 10 days...  (Read 12066 times)

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Offline DonMcJr

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Package Bees Dead after 10 days...
« on: April 24, 2014, 10:02:45 pm »
2 of Our club members got packages 10 days ago and installed them the same way right next to each other. One hive is totally dead after 10 days and the other is doing fine...

 Would one expect the supplier to do something about this? Just curious...
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Offline blueblood

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Re: Package Bees Dead after 10 days...
« Reply #1 on: April 24, 2014, 10:15:20 pm »
Probably not but worth a try calling.  None of my "survivor" bees caught on my own have right out died.  I have had more than a 50% death rate with my packages the last two years.  I called it quits on them last year.  Very slow and disappointing to me personally.

Offline LazyBkpr

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Re: Package Bees Dead after 10 days...
« Reply #2 on: April 24, 2014, 10:50:28 pm »
  You already know the variables are nearly infinite with beekeeping, so proving to a supplier that YOU didnt kill the bees somehow would be quite difficult...
   The reason its worth a try?  Some suppliers still have a little honor left, and will try to make it right so you keep ordering from them.
   The ones that laugh at you are the ones you and your club DONT order from the next year.
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Offline iddee

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Re: Package Bees Dead after 10 days...
« Reply #3 on: April 24, 2014, 10:56:51 pm »
10,000 bees die in 10 days when they looked healthy on arrival? I would say insecticide on the neighbor's garden or similar. If there was something wrong with them before shipping, they would either have arrived dead or dwindled over a month or more. I wouldn't expect the breeder to be responsible.
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Offline G3farms

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Re: Package Bees Dead after 10 days...
« Reply #4 on: April 24, 2014, 11:25:39 pm »
I also vote for a pesticide kill. Sounds like that one hive found someones shrubs or trees in bloom that have been sprayed.

Tell us more about what you saw at the hive entrance.....bees staggering around, disoriented, unable to fly.
Bees are bees and do as they please!

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Offline apisbees

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Re: Package Bees Dead after 10 days...
« Reply #5 on: April 24, 2014, 11:41:43 pm »
I eco what Iddee said some type of poisen to die in ten days. Bees could have been exposed prior to being shaken but should have had some dead in the package. But that package could have been shaken from a different yards, thus being exposed to different elemens. Did they mix their syrup
Together or did it on their own? Could one have used something that was contaminated? One never ran out of feed and staved with this cold late spring starvation could be a problem.

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Offline Bamabww

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Re: Package Bees Dead after 10 days...
« Reply #6 on: April 25, 2014, 07:26:51 am »
Bummer. That would certainly be disappointing and frustrating. If Iddee is correct, and it sounds very reasonable, it's something that could happen to any of us. Still a bummer though.
Wayne

Offline LazyBkpr

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Re: Package Bees Dead after 10 days...
« Reply #7 on: April 25, 2014, 08:38:54 am »
I'll be the one who disagrees..      ;D
   right next to each other.
One hive is totally dead after 10 days and the other is doing fine..

    The bees WILL find the same places to forage..
 If SOME of the bees in the other hive had died... maybe, but I don't buy it
with one hive unaffected.   I don't see one hive finding a large enough, and deadly enough source to kill the entire hive in such a short time, and leave the other hive untouched.
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Offline iddee

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Re: Package Bees Dead after 10 days...
« Reply #8 on: April 25, 2014, 09:21:53 am »
""The bees WILL find the same places to forage.. ""

Wrong. When the scouts hone in on a feeding area, the hive will work it until it quits producing. If the scouts from the 2 hives found 2 different feeding areas, they would not both be affected.
“Listen to the mustn'ts, child. Listen to the don'ts. Listen to the shouldn'ts, the impossibles, the won'ts. Listen to the never haves, then listen close to me... Anything can happen, child. Anything can be.”
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Offline tefer2

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Re: Package Bees Dead after 10 days...
« Reply #9 on: April 25, 2014, 09:38:25 am »
Don, those bees come from AWS?

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Re: Package Bees Dead after 10 days...
« Reply #10 on: April 25, 2014, 09:52:11 am »
I got 10 packages from AWS and they are all fine ( knock on wood).
Possibility? Could the queen have died in the one hive and everyone else moved to the queen right hive?

Offline G3farms

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Re: Package Bees Dead after 10 days...
« Reply #11 on: April 25, 2014, 02:02:06 pm »
""The bees WILL find the same places to forage.. ""

Wrong. When the scouts hone in on a feeding area, the hive will work it until it quits producing. If the scouts from the 2 hives found 2 different feeding areas, they would not both be affected.

I agree with this whole heartedly, just watch the bees on a bright sunny day, when they leave the hive they go in all different directions. 

With all of the bee junk sitting on my porch, there is sometimes a piece or two of wet comb. I will mark the workers with a paint pen and watch as they come and go, after a while it is only the marked bees returning and no unmarked ones. I guess there is not enough of the wet comb to REALLY excite them.

If it was something like sevin dust stuck in their hair and they carried it back to the hive all of the other bees that groomed them would of course spread it through out the hive.
Bees are bees and do as they please!

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Offline G3farms

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Re: Package Bees Dead after 10 days...
« Reply #12 on: April 25, 2014, 02:03:01 pm »
Don what is in your area that is blooming that would need to be sprayed?
Bees are bees and do as they please!

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Offline LazyBkpr

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Re: Package Bees Dead after 10 days...
« Reply #13 on: April 25, 2014, 05:15:08 pm »
""The bees WILL find the same places to forage.. ""

Wrong. When the scouts hone in on a feeding area, the hive will work it until it quits producing. If the scouts from the 2 hives found 2 different feeding areas, they would not both be affected.

I agree with this whole heartedly, just watch the bees on a bright sunny day, when they leave the hive they go in all different directions. 

With all of the bee junk sitting on my porch, there is sometimes a piece or two of wet comb. I will mark the workers with a paint pen and watch as they come and go, after a while it is only the marked bees returning and no unmarked ones. I guess there is not enough of the wet comb to REALLY excite them.

If it was something like sevin dust stuck in their hair and they carried it back to the hive all of the other bees that groomed them would of course spread it through out the hive.

 
  I know for a fact they use the same areas, have seen my carnys and itallians in the same flowers. Bees sugar dusted that morning on another beeks feeder nearly a mile away.  I have found my Italians foraging with the feral bees in my mothers flower gardens 2 miles away.
   When the neighbor doesn't cut his alfalfa in time and it blooms, every bee I have is foraging in that field.  The multiflower rose bushes in the bottom also draw every bee I have.  The Mulberry blooms, Apple trees, etc, etc, etc...
      I doubt very much if they ask their neighbors which direction they intend on searching today and agree to go to different areas.
   If we are talking about a flower pot with half a dozen flowers in it, I might agree, otherwise I will have to say I'm sorry, you cant convince me they dont forage the same areas when I know better. we will have to agree to disagree on this one.
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Offline iddee

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Re: Package Bees Dead after 10 days...
« Reply #14 on: April 25, 2014, 05:25:37 pm »
We don't have to disagree. We do agree. What I am saying is, each hive will work the first thing they find. If it's the same one another found, fine. If it's a different find, they will stay with that one until it is done. I did not say they wouldn't work the same things, I just said they would work what the scouts found until it is finished. It may be the same as another hive, or entirely different.
“Listen to the mustn'ts, child. Listen to the don'ts. Listen to the shouldn'ts, the impossibles, the won'ts. Listen to the never haves, then listen close to me... Anything can happen, child. Anything can be.”
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Offline DonMcJr

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Re: Package Bees Dead after 10 days...
« Reply #15 on: April 28, 2014, 12:55:15 am »
Sorry been real busy with the bee club and our earth fair...

Nothing was blooming that could have been sprayed. Both these packages were picked up from my truck after I got them amm from the supplyer and were in great condition. These women are friends and went right from picking them up to installing them same day. They had the hives 4 feet apart. It was 50's when they installed them and in the next 10 days it was below freezing at night and around 50 average daytime. About 3 days scattered around 70.

Nothing was blooming except Maple trees and such. None of our flowers starting blooming til a few days ago and not many my tulips in front of my house still arent flowers yet. Not even any dandelions yet.

So a very strange situation and yes from AWS but I know its nothing AWS did wrong...
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Offline tefer2

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Re: Package Bees Dead after 10 days...
« Reply #16 on: April 28, 2014, 09:12:36 am »
I started reading about all the bee losses coming out of almonds this year.(fungicide)
Were they placed in dead out equipment?
I think your problem started in Orland. Let us know if you guys lose any more.

Offline Intheswamp

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Re: Package Bees Dead after 10 days...
« Reply #17 on: April 28, 2014, 10:32:51 am »
Don, was the dead hive full of dead bees?  Bees scattered on the ground in front of the entrance?  Were the bees ever observed bringing *anything* into the hive?

Was the equipment identical and from the same vendor?  Was the equipment stored in the same location and in the same fashion prior to the package bees installation?

Are the hives in an low-visibility area or visible by people passing by?   ...since there wasn't anything for them to be foraging on I'm thinking of a possible intentional insecticide spraying by someone, but that person was driven away by the angry bees before they could spray the second hive. 

Were the two hives fed the same feed from the same batches...sugar syrup, pollen patties?  Was the syrup given in identical containers? ...feed prepared in same container?  ...possible contaminated container or feed used on one hive but something different used on the other one.

To the experts...what disease is there that can run rampant through a population of honey bees (can't really call it a colony yet as it sounds like it never got established) and completely kill it in 10 days?  To me, ten days just seems too short of a time period for something non-chemical to wipe out that many bees, provided there was that many dead bees in/around the hive and not simply missing.  Of course, if there is a disease that could take a new package out that fast I'm all ears to hear about it...my education continues. :)

Ed

Offline Riverrat

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Re: Package Bees Dead after 10 days...
« Reply #18 on: April 28, 2014, 11:35:21 am »
You didn't mention this so I assume they was feeding the new packages.
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Offline DonMcJr

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Re: Package Bees Dead after 10 days...
« Reply #19 on: April 28, 2014, 11:53:12 am »
Bees were dead inside the hive mostly a few outside...

Equipment brand new from same supplier.

I believe they fed them the same sugar syrup but I can ask...

were in the country so I doubt anyone sprayed them on purpose...

ill attach 2 pics...



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