Possible Honey House?

[Perry]

OK, here's the deal.
I no sooner started building my Honey House than I realized it was no where big enough. Between storing supers, etc. there was no way that I was ever going to get my extracting set-up in there. We did however, purchase 2 acres of land with a well and septic in place, about 15 minutes away (out of town), that will be a great spot for an apiary.
I have been wondering what I could possibly afford to build on it if ever I could.
Well, something presented itself, and I am looking into it. What I need are honest opinions as to whether this is a stupid idea or not.
I can pick up a 1994/1995 doublewide office trailer that is 28 X 64 feet (almost 1,800 sq.ft.). It has triple axles on each half, with a roof that drops/folds down for transport. It has 2 bathrooms and a huge ducted air-conditioning system, all electrical with new mast, etc.
I figure I can easily remove a lot of the partition/office walls and open it up big time. Keep 1 bathroom, set up a triple sink,etc. for an extracting area, an office, and the rest would be a shop for building stuff.
The price is 15k, and to take it apart, move it, and set it up looks to be around 6k.

The first pic is the double-wide, and it's (64 feet not 60)
http://www.kijiji.ca/v-other-real-estate/annapolis-valley/mobile-office-trailers-for-sale/575895075

Bad idea?

[iddee]

I think you will find it is 60 feet plus a four foot tongue.
I would get a turnkey quote and offer them 18,000 minus the move and setup, giving you a total setup building for 18G.
You can always go up, but you can never go down on an offer. See how they respond.

[G3farms]

Why are they selling it? Do they need rid of it because of some time constraint or a job is complete, or , or....
If they are in a bind to get it moved the price will go down.

Contact some other people that move and set up trailers to see what they charge.
Contact other office trailer rental places and see what a used one is worth.

I think it would make a good honey house if the price is right.

[LazyBkpr]

Holy smokes..
   Our first house was a 10 x 50 trailer I rebuilt, then I added a 12 x 12 2 story addition for bedrooms..     Perry you can LIVE in that and still have enough room to store everything..    One MAN CAVE being delivered!


    I don't know how handy you are.. I am going to assume your about as handy as I am from what I have seen..
   Is it possible for you to have them placed, then do the set up yourself?
   Also thinking that for 18 grand you can almost build something of similar size, but it would entail a lot more labor on your part..  that double wide already has the bathrooms etc..   But you DO live in Canada.. skirting and insulation will be mandatory unless your going to drain the pipes for winter?
  Naw, you need to keep some heat in there..  Set up your table saw etc in one end..  DONT forget the referigerator. Refer in the man cave is mandatory!  Leave two small rooms so I don't have to listen to Iddfee snore.   

[shinjak]

I'm not sure about your zoning laws in Canada, but if there is no house on the property make sure you can setup an "accessory" use as the primary use. In other words, does the primary use have to be a residence or can the sole building be a non-residence. Of course, the authorities don't really have to know that it's not a residence.

[Slowmodem]

That was kind of my first thought.  Check the required permits and regulations before you buy.

[Perry]

Great feedback!

Iddee, I measured it out and it is 64 feet plus 4 feet of hitch. (I forgot that they count the hitch length LOL). Either way it is huge, even compared to what we live in now.

G3, they have moved their offices to an Industrial park in Kentville, 20 minutes away. These were too small and became redundant with the move. I don't think they are hurting to have them moved, but I would never offer full asking anyway.

Lazy, I can do some of it myself, but the move no. There are a couple of outfits that do this for a living, and I have to assume they can do it quicker and safer than I ever could. I am thinking wood shop at one end, extracting room at the other, office/cave and washroom in the middle. Office might even be big enough to hold classes in (or cots for those hangin out).

Shinjack and Greg, you have hit upon an important topic. I have been running into a brick wall with planning in the county. When the bank tore the old house down they removed any foundation of it as well. When I approached the county advising them that I wanted to build a shop/honey house, they said sure, 120 feet back from the front lot line! That's 100 feet down slope from the well and septic! They said any kind of agricultural building has to meet new rules. (neighbour has 3 barns/buildings about 30 feet from same said line). I explained that the building would be more of a shop than an Ag. building, but they wouldn't have it.
If I had a residence on the property I could build the "shop" anywhere. A residence is defined as a house, mobile, cottage.
I figure I could move this onto the property, set it up, and who is to decide what I do in my own "residence"? I extract in the one I have now!
The value of the land and building would almost triple by doing this as well, something we could sell for retirement income as I slow down.

[LazyBkpr]

"town"  or... actually ANY ordinances can be a pain....
   Ran into a LOT of them living in Maine, and its PART of the reason I left.
   My kids broke a window in the house.. So I replaced it with a GOOD vinyl window, double paned etc...   Then I was fined $75.00 for not having a permit...  I got a 75 dollar fine when I put the rest of the windows in..  I got a 75 dollar fine for putting up the Kennel, I got a 75 dollar fine for putting a deck on the back of the house... and when I got a 75 dollar fine for putting a new walkway in the front, the code enforcement officer was JUST flabbergasted with me..
   WHY WONT YOU FILE FOR A PERMIT?
   
   The permit usually ran from 100 to 500 dollars, and it took anywhere from two weeks to a month to be approved.

    Our 10 x 50 trailer had to be approved for use in our town..  BECAUSE it was a trailer built in 1958 they refused our permit..    We fought them for almost a year.. the trailer was ALL new, the only 1958 left was the frame, they still refused...    After a year, I hooked my father in laws dump truck to it and pulled it out to our lot..   Three days later we were  moved in...   We got fined 200 dollars....   This after paying for a desk, a desk light two picture frames and a coffee cup when the code enforcement officers DESK got flipped upside down onto his lap...
   I know what your thinking.. but it was NOT me that did it.. it was my wife!!!
   She went on a campaign to have the code enforcement officer removed... it lasted three months and he resigned.. then she went on the campaign to get her uncle elected, and he was...     so after that, he came to our house because of a call.. one time.. after that he would call my wife and ask if he needed to come out or just send us the fine???


   So fast forward 12 or so years ago.. I had enough of it all and moved back to Iowa...
   I go see the Iowa equivalent of a code enforcement officer...

   "I have a house to fix up and one to build, what permits etc do I need?"
   
   "None that I am aware of."

   "Not even for building the new house?"
   
   "Your the one has to live in it."

    Do you have ANY idea, how nice it is to flip houses, fix houses and BUILD houses with NO Fines? No Permits? No code enforcement officer?

   Oh, we had to get our electrical inspected in the new house...
   Only had one problem... we had to use these new circuit breakers in our panel.. they are ground fault... and cost four times a normal breaker...
   Problem with them is they are constantly being tripped...  so I put a regular breaker in about 5 slots..
   Freezer, ceiling fans and TV, range hood and Bedroom TV..

   So he wouldnt pass us, told me we couldnt move in..
   I asked if he was going to be there to try to stop us...
   Whats so hard about putting the right breakers in?
   I am not going to go out and reset them every 15 min... Tell me why they blow I will fix the problem..
   Well...  nothing is wrong with the wiring, its just "cheap" Ceiling fans.
   
   "I asked him for that in writing, so I could make the company that made them replace our two $300.00 ceiling fans."

   He signed the inspection and left......


    Sometimes its knowing what you can get away with, sometimes its getting away with what you know, and sometimes its a matter of putting the wife in charge of something.. 

   Like you said Perry..  It is a residence...
   Running a line from the well wouldnt be terrible.. but hooking to the septic would be...     In MAINE, a structure could be put anywhere if it was moveable.. like you said, any structure had to be a certain distance from the property line..  Unless it was moveable...    so the shed I built 4 feet from the property line had SKIDS under it...
   Can you leave the axles under the house?

[pistolpete]

Great story Lazy.   As for Perry:  If you're headed down the commercial path, wouldn't you really want something on a concrete slab so that you can use a small forklift?   And if you're not going commercial  then any 200 sq. Ft. shack with water and electricity should do for a honey house.   You might even consider 2 shipping containers  set about 12 feet apart with a temporary roof spanning between them.

Having said that, improving the re-sale value of your land may have to be a bigger consideration than what the best honey house would be.   Would someone consider buying this double wide for a residence in the future?

[Perry]

If I go this route, the axles can stay on the frame, but wheels and tires no (they're not on there now).
In a perfect world, a honey house would have a concrete floor, but I don't see a need for a forklift, even down the road.
I do not really intend to go commercial even though number wise I am considered commercial now. I honestly believe the 50 colony mark is my comfort zone. Doing inspections on much larger operations has allowed me to make that choice without having to spend all the money to find out. I see nothing wrong with it, it's just not for me at this stage of my life.
Pete, you are absolutely correct. With 15k for the land (well and septic included), and another 20k for the mobile (which can easily be set up as a 1,800 sq.ft. home) I would venture to say that the value of the two combined would triple, or at the very least, double.

[blueblood]

"build it and they will come...."

[efmesch]

Perry, I'm surprised at you, not giving the measurements in metric.  So I did the job myself and, if I didn't make any mistakes, you're talking about a building of about 167 sq meters.  That's bigger than my home, in which I raised a family of seven children.  Kinda big for a honey operation of 50 hives and the asssociated carpentry shop and honey house.
If your prime concern is to raise the value of the property, go for it (maybe) but if your reason is honey, it seems to me like a bit of overkill.

The reason for my  "maybe" is this:  Two years ago you bit off a big chunk and drove yourself up to the limits when you bought and fixed up your present home.  I know you love it and have the pride of accomplishment that comes with successfully lifting such a project,  but--- Do you remember the intense pressures it put on you and the family? 
DO YOU WANT TO GO THROUGH THIS AGAIN?
If your real reason is to set up a honey house to serve your needs, I would recommend that you be a good bit more "modest" with your plans.  But, as I said, if your prime reason is to raise the propertty value and secondarily use it as a honey house,  go for it----JUST DON'T SET A DEADLINE THAT WILL RUN YOU OUT OF YOUR MIND.   Do it slow and easy and don't let it ruin your life.
Just one man's opinion.
Your concerned friend,
Ef

[LazyBkpr]

I am actually going to agree with Ef..  if its going to be a strain it may be better to take a step back.. take a breath and think about it.

    Having said that.. I will also say that ROOM is difficult to come by.  I have a space of about 24x24 feet FILLED with extra gear.  JUST, boxes, floors, tele covers, extra frames, etc, etc,,   theres also a solar wax melter in that spot, along with my scraping and cleaning bench...    AND,   I dont have 50 hives yet..    A place to safely store supers would be invaluable to me...    So I have a 24 x 24 filled with gear, leaving enough room to walk about..   My WOOD shop where I make all my stuff is about 20 x 20, and when I bring in 12' boards it seems pretty crowded...  And my extracting area, with cooktop for melting wax is about 10 x 20. My extractor, cook top, benches, deep sink etc all reside in this area..
    So his space compared to mine?  I have about 1200 square feet in the three seperate areas if I dont count where I keep all my scrap wood etc..  28 x 64 is gaining about 600 square feet over what I have. Thats a room of about 24.5 x 24.5...
      So, I have to say...    Being in the same boat as Perry as far as plans and future of what I do...   IF.. I could work that out?

   No, we are too different....   18000 dollars... I would level the ground, have gravel brought in, install the drains/toilet plumbing and have concrete poured.. 2 grand...   I would put up the walls myself, insulate/wire.. and use particle board for the inside walls.ceiling so I could put a nail anywhere to hold something...  shelf, wire to hang stuff from etc...   Roof and shingle or TIN myself. Run plumbing and wiring to how " I " Wanted it run..  Meaning I can have six outlets on one wall if I so desire...   about 10 to 12 grand... less than fifteen K for a similar sized building that IS permanant..   A LOT more work, but nothing horrible to accomplish.   
   Perry...  how hard is it to get in and out of Canada?  I'll come help we will have it FINISHED in two weeks as long as the pad is ready when I get there.

[efmesch]

......   Perry...  how hard is it to get in and out of Canada?  I'll come help we will have it FINISHED in two weeks as long as the pad is ready when I get there.

Lazy, now you're talking!  You  make me feel like saying  "count me in", but I'd probably just get in your ways.  :'(

[Slowmodem]

I do not really intend to go commercial even though number wise I am considered commercial now. I honestly believe the 50 colony mark is my comfort zone.

With that many hives, and the cost of the land and the cost of the trailer, have you considered incorporating?  I don't know how the laws work up there, but there might be tax advantages of depreciating your equipment over time if you went into business.