Author Topic: New nuc. Is this ok? (Read 8994 times)

Steve4548 · « **on:** June 06, 2014, 07:01:09 pm »

After much delay I received my nuc last night and installed today. In it I had 5 drawn frames. 60 percent packed with nectar. Very little capped brood. I did see eggs larvae and 3 frames of bees. ...... In addition to all of this I have 4 queen cups on the top third of one frame. Two had eggs in them. Should I be concerned with this?

Steve4548 · « **Reply #1 on:** June 06, 2014, 07:02:28 pm »

How long should I wait to go back in

LazyBkpr · « **Reply #2 on:** June 06, 2014, 07:08:33 pm »

Did you have a queen?
I would check those cups with eggs in about four days to see if they are being drawn out.. If they are I would be concerned. Does the queen have a good brood pattern? New queen installed in this nuc or established queen?

Steve4548 · « **Reply #3 on:** June 06, 2014, 08:23:03 pm »

I didn't see the queen when I was installing them. They were pretty loud and I saw eggs. But not a lot. More nectar than anythjng

Steve4548 · « **Reply #4 on:** June 06, 2014, 08:24:26 pm »

It's tough as this is my first hive. They were really loud in the instal but that could be normal

Steve4548 · « **Reply #5 on:** June 06, 2014, 08:29:47 pm »

I'll try to get pictures. But I was focused on taking my time and killing as few as possible

apisbees · « **Reply #6 on:** June 07, 2014, 02:53:57 am »

As LaztBkpr stated go in and look at the queen cells in 4 days. also look for eggs If no eggs are found then I would expect that the queen was lost. With out knowing how and when the nuc was put together it is hard to know if the nuc was just put together with brood and eggs from the donor hive and the queen was lost during the making of the nuc or whether she was laying in the nuc and got lost, failed, or killed, during transportation and transe4ring them in to your hive.

Intheswamp · « **Reply #7 on:** June 07, 2014, 10:47:08 am »

This is from a newbie's point of view so take it for what it's worth...

If this was a "Five Minute Nuc" then the cell cups could have come from one donor colony, the frames of nectar from another, and the patch of brood from yet another. The queen...from "somewhere". It's hard to tell.

At this point I would contact the seller about your concerns, you certainly did not bargain to buy a bunch of nectar, don't be harsh with him/her but let him know what you ended up with. You will find out quickly if you want to do any future business with them.

If these are all of your bees (no other colony) and you don't have a friend with bees close by that will let you have some capped brood then you have no resources to draw from. I would leave the bees alone and let them sort this out...I don't think there is anything you can do that will help them at this point other than to give them some time to do what bees do...attempt to survive.

Leave the queen cups alone, you probably need them, though a queen could be lurking in there somewhere. You mentioned that they made a loud noise when you hived them...I take it that there is a good population of bees. If so, then there's a good chance that they will successfully make a new queen from one of those queen cups...if they need one.

I would give the bees several days to settle in and get established. If per chance you peek inside and see some queen cells formed, gently put the cover back on and back away from the hive...the best that could happen at that point if you go into the hive is that you don't mash the cells...and this may be the last chance for those bees to make a new queen and if they don't make (or already have) a queen the colony is doomed.

If you're not sure what to do...do nothing. The bees know what to do.

Definitely call the seller and let him know what you have and that you are willing to give the bees a chance *or* that you're not happy with the purchase and would like to do something else. The first option will let him know you are willing to work with him...the second option might be viewed as an "ultimatum" and somewhat alienate the seller. Of course, you might have gotten them from a great beekeeper that will instantly want to make it right. Call them.

Best wishes,
Ed

Steve4548 · « **Reply #8 on:** June 07, 2014, 04:50:21 pm »

This was supposed to be established. I think there may just be a problem and the decided to replace her. I have contacted the seller and they were nice and recommended placing empty frame in the middle to give the queen room. I'm not sure on the timeline but I did have some fresh looking egga

Steve4548 · « **Reply #9 on:** June 07, 2014, 04:50:54 pm »

Thank you all for the help I plan on checking the cells on Monday.

Intheswamp · « **Reply #10 on:** June 07, 2014, 10:36:16 pm »

Sounds like you bought from some good folks and will get it straightened out.

Best wishes,
Ed

Steve4548 · « **Reply #11 on:** June 09, 2014, 02:43:57 pm »

I found the queen today. Still very plugged up with nectar. But they drew out two frames

Intheswamp · « **Reply #12 on:** June 09, 2014, 04:34:08 pm »

There ya go!!!! She looks like a nice one, but looks aren't everything, eh? Give'em some time.

I know you mentioned that it's plugged with nectar. Can you give us a picture or two of your brood patches? Are you feeding?

How about those queen cups....any development on them?

Ed

LazyBkpr · « **Reply #13 on:** June 09, 2014, 04:43:07 pm »

Glad to see the queen!!
The frame you are holding looks to be the sixth frame, or from the cenbter of the box? If so it looks really plugged out with nectar and pollen.. but I cant see the whole thing..
Typically they will have most of the nectar on the outer frames and the outer edges of the middle frames, then a ring of pollen and the brood area.. Most of what I see is nectar and a bit of pollen here and there.. are there areas in the middle of those frames for the queen to lay? No pollen/nectar etc plugging them up?

Steve4548 · « **Reply #14 on:** June 09, 2014, 05:04:48 pm »

That is the sixth frame out. I think she is laying as as she gets space. I will put up a video when I can get it on you tube. They drew out almost two frames already. So hopefully they will move things around for her. Most every frame is still at least half nextar

Intheswamp · « **Reply #15 on:** June 09, 2014, 05:12:55 pm »

Lazy, do you think if he took one of the nectar plugged frames and shook it out that the bees finish cleaning it out so the queen could lay in it or do you think they would simply start refilling it? What if one was moved above the inner cover for them to rob? If they get honey bound something's going to happen I'm afraid.

Ed

Garden Hive · « **Reply #16 on:** June 09, 2014, 08:07:38 pm »

All of the frames appear to be full of bees. Maybe the far outside might not be fully drawn. Do you have any empty frames that are just foundation in that brood box? If not or they are just about full, (I) would add another box and definitley not feed anything. If there is a frame that is all nectar then I would put it in the upper box and replace it in the lower with an empty.

LazyBkpr · « **Reply #17 on:** June 09, 2014, 08:11:04 pm »

I have done exactly that. they will clean the remaining nectar up and put it back into cells, but it will take less space and give the queen some room. They NEED nectar/syrup, but they dont need every frame over half full of it. I would try to clean out a couple of them. If they have new frames drawn and have not also filled those with nectar the queen may be busy laying int hem already, so the situation may resolve itself.
If most of the frames are drawn, adding anothjer box and moiving a couple of the frames of nectar up, replacing them with new frames may also help. They have the nectar they need to draw wax, give them something to use it on and get it out of the brood chamber.

Edit.. Garden Hive said it well too. Posted while I was typing.

Steve4548 · « **Reply #18 on:** June 10, 2014, 04:29:43 am »

I have about three empty frames left to draw. Can I add the empty with that much left

Papakeith · « **Reply #19 on:** June 10, 2014, 07:15:28 am »

I'm going to recap to make sure that I have the picture right in my head.
You bought a 5 frame nuc of fully drawn comb .
You then hived the nuc in a 10 frame Langstroth deep with 5 more frames of foundation.
You noticed queen cups and found it full (or nearly so ) with nectar. Were there larvae in those cups?

Sounds honey/nectar bound, and there was no place for your queen to lay. This could have caused the bees to create the cups to begin the process of superseding.
Did you move the empty frame into the center of the deep like the seller suggested?
If there are three undrawn frames left in the deep. I might be more inclined to place at least one of those frames in the center of the brood give it a week and then place a second box on. You should be right about in the middle of one of the heaviest flows of the Springtime.
I'd stop feeding (if you still are) until you put the second box on.