Oxalic Acid Discussion

[Lburou]

Good Luck bakersdozen!  :-)

[Slowmodem]

Not about beekeeping, but I ran across this quote from Harpo Marx this evening and thought it relative to the thread.   

[on accommodation, while touring] Cheap hotels in the South and Southwest were apparently set up as bug sanctuaries by some Audubon Society for Insects. Fleas, ticks, bedbugs, cockroaches, beetles, scorpions and ants, having no enemies, attacked with fearless abandon. They had the run of the house and they knew it. After a while you just let them bite. Fighting back was useless. For every bug you squashed, a whole fresh, bloodthirsty platoon would march out of the woodwork. In one hotel hotel the ants were so bad that each bed was set on four pots of oxalic acid.

[capt44]

Just to let ya'll know they have approved Oxalic Acid in Arkansas now.
I am going to start treating the 1st week in September using the vaporizor method.

[capt44]

I have all my hives treated with oxalic acid using the vaporizer.
I am going to treat again on September 22nd.
The bees never get upset on the treating.

[LazyBkpr]

Good deal! The only reason mine get a little upset is because the entrance is blocked for a bit. When I remove the rag all returns to normal.

[Gypsi]

"   Thats the beauty of being a beekeeper, you do it your way!"

"   I am VERY MUCH WITH Mrs. River (Riverbee) in her philosophy of dont treat if it is not needed. I feel that OAV gives me that freedom. The freedom to wait and watch, and yet, be ready to FIX a problem in mere moments.
  I believe that the bees will not build, or show resistances if there is nothing to resist. The only way we will know if we are succeeding in creating bees that can co exist with Varroa, is if we WAIT, and force them to fight back..  Those who cannot fight back get treated, and given a different queen, raised from a colony that IS at the very least TRYING to fight back..."

"   Do you really think it takes longer than treating with any other method? Is 2.5 minutes per hive longer than it takes to break down the hive?
    In order to treat with hopguard, i have to open the hives. I have to get to the lower brood box, which, for me means removing the two upper boxes. Then i can place the strips in as the instructions require."

My VSH bees, at least one hive of them, aren't very VSH anymore, this is a 4th generation queen. Mites showed in drone brood rather than on my sticky.  My battery is too small (easier to carry) and the first battery was also too old (4 years) but after a treatment a morning I re-start the series next week. l am pleased with the mite drop on the hive I didn't actually see any problem with, and will check this morning to see if the Beeweavers hive really needed treated, it got it just because yesterday.

The big difference with the OA, besides not having to go deeply into hives to place strips, is not having to remember to go back into hives to REMOVE strips.  Plus I like the not building up in the wax, not a true insecticide.  The hive I treated on Tuesday looks great, I don't think I lost a bee or any brood. I am very happy with this. (they are a very productive survivor swarm hive I picked up the swarm in March)

The 4th generation hive got fairly upset about being treated but the battery died on them the evening before then I was back in with a new battery Wednesday morning and didn't get the entrance super well blocked. Never thought of a rag, good thought for last week, they were pushing past my tape.

[efmesch]

LazyBkpr posted this link in another thread ("Things I've noticed") and those interested  in seeing how to do an Oxalic Acid treatment might not spot it there so I've placed it here.  Remember, after the first video plays, youtube gives us links to more on the same topic, so you can get additional how-to info.
Thanks go to Lazy!

[Gypsi]

thank you for the video efmesch

[Papakeith]

Thanks for this discussion.  Having all of this material in one place is invaluable.
I may have missed it, but what are the best options out there for vaporizers?  Where to get them, etc?

[LazyBkpr]

   http://oxavap.com/
   http://www.members.shaw.ca/orioleln/vaporizer.html

   I also believe that Don (The Fat Bee man) sells one that he has made by someone near him.


   I have the Varrox. At the time I ordered mine, it had rave reviews, and many had been using it for six or seven years by that point with no issues.  I have been using mine two or three years, and have treated with it over 500 times, and it continues to work as well as when it was new.
   Reading about the Heilizer (sp) It seems that people are also quite happy with it as well.

[Papakeith]

a few months ago I started down the path of building my own vaporizer. I purchased a heating element and started machining the pan for the vaporization process.  Along the way, I decided that I should just purchase one and be done with it. 
Many of the offerings look like they were put together in a hobbyists garage. Not that they are bad products, they just don't look like a finished product. Not the Varrox though.The varrox looks like a more refined product.  It certainly seems to have stood the test of time so far.  My only question is that I wonder if the fit and finish is worth the extra 40$ 
I'll let you all know  

Thanks lazy for this resource.

[Bee Commander]

I use the Heilyser. I am only in my second season and this spring tested my hives finding a high mite load in some of them. After tons of research I went with OAV. After reading about all the disclaimers on Apivar, MAQs etc., OAV seemed like the perfect solution, kinda like mite treatment for dummies. It was. It's so simple, not hard on the bees. After 4 rounds in April 5-7 days apart, hives that were lackluster in performance literally exploded. One of my hives had a mite count of 12%... was in a downward spiral. After treatment, it was amazing to see the difference.

Yes I have had a whiff of the stuff. Brutal. I now wear a respirator. Not worth taking chances. I have heard that OAV may be effective on tracheal mites. After having a whiff of it I can believe it. Has anyone else heard that?

Another question I had was has anyone noticed when using OAV any detrimental effects on open brood. I have read that OAV can be fatal to open brood, but have not experienced that myself.

[Jen]

Papakeith ~ "a few months ago I started down the path of building my own vaporizer. I purchased a heating element and started machining the pan for the vaporization process.  Along the way, I decided that I should just purchase one and be done with it. 
Many of the offerings look like they were put together in a hobbyists garage. Not that they are bad products, they just don't look like a finished product. Not the Varrox though.The varrox looks like a more refined product.  It certainly seems to have stood the test of time so far.  My only question is that I wonder if the fit and finish is worth the extra 40$ 

   Hey Keith    I've been using a Heilyser for two seasons now. It's fast, effective, I know it won't kill any of my bees or the queen. I'm not afraid of it. I did a lot of researsh and read a lot of reviews on OAV, sold me! More than once the reviews said "The Varrox is the cadillac, but the Heilyser is the Honda. Both good vehicles, and both will get you to the same place effectively." I find that to be true.



   

[Mikey N.C.]

What is the bleaching boxes, frames .haven't seen any information about, is it just a way to use OA in the states where it's not legal ? ?

[Perry]

What is the bleaching boxes, frames .haven't seen any information about, is it just a way to use OA in the states where it's not legal ? ?

 

[Mikey N.C.]

I see  thanks

[neillsayers]

 Jen said:               
Hey Keith    I've been using a Heilyser for two seasons now. It's fast, effective, I know it won't kill any of my bees or the queen. I'm not afraid of it. I did a lot of researsh and read a lot of reviews on OAV, sold me! More than once the reviews said "The Varrox is the cadillac, but the Heilyser is the Honda. Both good vehicles, and both will get you to the same place effectively." I find that to be true.



Jen, who markets this product?

[Jen]

I purchased mine from the website. Once in a while you can find them used, but I didn't want to take chances on potential failure of the vaporizer. And consider too, that each treatment is just pennys.

http://www.members.shaw.ca/orioleln/vaporizer.html
 
Also Neil, make sure you have 99% Oxalic Acid. Products like wood bleach have additives in it. Amazon.com is where I bought my OA.

[neillsayers]

Thanks Jen,

I have the OA in my amazon wishlist and was percolating on building my own but I want to look at the one you mentioned.

[LazyBkpr]

   I have never had any issues with using OAV even before it was approved here in Iowa, but fo those who wish to toe the line, using an unapproved product in hives used for commercial honey or bee/nuc production might cause issues. So those folks dont use OA for mites, they use it to bleach their frames a couple times a year! There is nothing illegal about that, since it IS approved for use as a wood bleach.