Reversing Hive Bodies

[Jen]

Because my 3 hives are showing signs of ramping up, I would like some advice on reversing hive bodies. I know I need a warm 65 day. You can see that my hives begin with a deep then continue with mediums. This is hubby's idea, but it does pose a problem when reversing hives.

[iddee]

Then don't do it. What is the purpose? It is usually better to not do anything, then to do something you are not sure of, or not sure of the results.

[Jen]

I like that advice, Thanks Iddee, I'll wait until a nice warm day a take a look deeper. I do know that two of the hives had ample room left at the end of Fall. 

[riverbee]

i don't reverse hives.......and agree with iddee jen.

[Jen]

Thanks Riv- I do believe I have asked this question before, had quite a discussion last Fall, now I just have to keep in my memory. There's the rub 

[LazyBkpr]

I do, and it makes a HUGE difference on swarming.. but the bees have to BE in the top of the hive to do it.
   I still dont know your weather there.. is it SPRING there? Or do you still have winter ahead of you?  If you have Dandelions blooming.. Has spring arrived or not?   Doing NOTHING may well have you in the same situation you were last year.
   And yes, if it does happen, just make a drink, and go out in your Jammies to watch, and enjoy. I am also still in a bit of confusion about what you have for honey stores.. if your frames are still loaded with honey, reversing wont make any difference..

[iddee]

You and her both are very near the 42nd lateral parallel north. Other than altitude, should be about the same.

[LazyBkpr]

It's that ocean breeze that messes things up.

[iddee]

It's that ocean breeze coming over the mountains on a 70 degree day, cooling as it goes up, and dropping snow that night. She's on the eastern slopes

[Ray4852]

I don’t reverse my hive bodies, if the bottom box is empty, I take two frames of brood out of the top box and put it  in the bottom box. I leave the middle frames open for the queen to lay. The top box, I leave the middle frames open also. If both boxes are full of bees and you cant make splits because you cant get queens. You have to do something different. I bridge in another deep box to give the queen more room to lay. Now she has 3 deeps to lay eggs. I put on my queen excluder and my super at the same time. 99 percent of time my bees will not swarm. our Bees know when its time to build up. They know mother nature better than we do. I try to keep ahead of them. First nice day in the spring. I go thru all my hives once. If I think they need more room to lay I bridge in another deep. All boxes are covered with cover clothes to help keep them warm. It only takes me 10 minutes to do the work with one hive. When I’m done I sit back till the middle part of June till I can get some local queens. Now I make nucs. My bees wont swarm. I wont let them. If you never worked with a 3 deep system. You are in for a big surprise when you open one up. You are dealing with a very massive hive. Be safe.

[Beeman]

Hi,

I do practice most of the time. The key & possible danger is splitting the cluster. If you can split without doing that, then your choice.

[riverbee]

i don't reverse. i keep bees in double deeps. the bees are smarter than we are and know what to do. same concept applies when hiving a package or a nuc. hive them in a deep or two mediums, and when they need the extra space, place it below them, not above them.  this goes against everything we have read or for some, what we have been traditionally taught to do. not sure how to explain this or why it works, but it does. the bees move down. winter; the queen and bees move up during winter months. when pollen and nectar become available, the bees start filling the top box/ boxes and 'move' the queen down. they move down on their own. reversing can sometimes separate the brood, and most often times does because the bees are in two boxes irregardless of the configuration.

like ray, and many other northern keeps, i have found myself short on getting queens when i want them. i keep an eye on what's going on. best thing to do is utilize  queen cells to make up nucs/divides/splits or light divides to my best colonies to avert swarming and/or sometimes also added supers or supers of foundation to keep them busy and keep them from swarming.  no excluder with foundation, and no excluder with drawn foundation until i see these being worked and filled, and before the queen gets really busy and laying up in them.

bees will swarm. it's their nature.

ray, i have kept 3 deep systems, a lot of hard work. 

[Ray4852]

Riverbee

I agree its work. I can tell you have experience with the 3 deep system. What I like about it. It cuts down on swarming, I get more honey, I have more bees to make better nucs. What I don’t like about it. 3 deeps turn into a mite factory. Its work keeping the mite load down to a safe level. You know what its like to keep bees up north. When you talk I listen. You educated me about that homasote board. Its been so cold here. I wont take the cover off  till it warms up a little.

[rwlaw]

"3 deeps turn into a mite factory"
Sorry to get off topic, but I ran the 3 deeps last year, mainly because of the good flows we were having and didn't want to deal with late season swarms. I noticed the same thing, I'm thinking it's because they pumped out such a large amount of drones.
And no I don't reverse hive bodies.

[Perry]

I run double deeps, but if I happen across one boiling over I'm not above throwing a third one on there, it happens.
I do reverse in the spring but only if all the brood is in the upper box.
Now about river's post "the bees are smarter than we are",.............................speak for yourself!

[riverbee]

i admit it perry!.............. .............

3 deep system is and can be a great deal of management, especially if you follow the university of minnesota's teaching method on this.

[Slowmodem]

I've experimented with swapping hive bodies, but I don't know if it did any good or not.  However, another year I didn't reverse, both hives swarmed.  So after long and meaningful deliberations with myself, I think having a bee vacuum is a good tool to have available  (especially with the price of bees now!).

[Gypsi]

I just reversed my hygenic hive but virtually all the bees brood and food were in the top, the bottom was empty comb (it's a double deep - but in the same situation I also reverse mediums.) 

I am MUCH farther south, and it is acting springy here, by reversing I had access to that empty comb and was able to swap them for full honey frames in case winter returns.  If I did not reverse them I'd have an empty bottom box, a full 2nd box and had to add another deep on.  My hive stand sits about 20 inches off the ground and a 3 stack is hard on me.

When I went to add the now thawed honey frames the bees had already begun filling the top box.

All beekeeping is local. The #1 reason to reverse is full top box empty bottom box.

[Yankee11]

Very good video on  this topic.

[brooksbeefarm]

Atta boy perry i like your thinking. I have tried not reversing my two deeps and had more swarming than when i did. In my area the queen moves up in the top box lays it full and refuses to move down and i start seeing swarm cells, the bottom box will have 3 to 4 frames of pollen and the rest open comb. By then it's to late to switch, so i make up nucs, like slow says, with the price of bees you can't afford to loose bees. It may have something to do with the age of the queen? you know how women are , they don't like to stay where people know them and watch them grow OLD, they would rather go where nobody knows them. Jack