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Author Topic: New package problem  (Read 7124 times)

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Offline badgerbeekernube66

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Re: New package problem
« Reply #20 on: May 07, 2016, 05:44:21 am »
I have a ton of healthy young bees next door. I have inspection to do on Sunday. If they are starting to draw comb is that a sign that they are feeling better?
I put the FB on them 6 days ago and they haven't gone through a half gallon yet, though they seem to be taking it more readily now that I have removed tainted frames, also they are taking more of the pollen patty.
What signs should I be looking for as far as when I should give them a frame of brood and nurse bees?
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Offline riverbee

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Re: New package problem
« Reply #21 on: May 12, 2016, 09:09:05 pm »
sorry badgerbeek, been sorta mia..........

are they starting to draw comb? is the queen laying? the only concern i would have is taking away resources from a hive to give to a hive that may be sickly or not gonna make it........if the bees are turning around, it may be beneficial to give them a frame of bees and brood to boost them. 

keep syrup on them until the frames are drawn, and keep checking on their progress! 

post back, let us know how it's going!
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Offline badgerbeekernube66

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Re: New package problem
« Reply #22 on: May 13, 2016, 08:44:06 am »
Update. Not good. The hive has dwindled down to a few cups of bees. It's sad.
So I've decided to not buy packages any more and purchase nucs instead until I can sustain my own hive numbers with splits.
I met a keep in Ashland county that is willing to teach me what he knows. My wife and I are heading up there memorial week as they are going to be doing splits at his big yard.
As for my 3 hives, one over winter is about ready to be split, will do that after the cold front moves through, and they will all be sent out to there permanent homes next weekend.
Thanks again to all who tried to help me in this predicament.
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Offline apisbees

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Re: New package problem
« Reply #23 on: May 13, 2016, 11:41:24 am »
Did the queen ever get started laying? If she did and the brood pattern looked good, you could cage the queen take a split from the other hive. pull a nuc and introduce the queen into the nuc.
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Offline badgerbeekernube66

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Re: New package problem
« Reply #24 on: May 13, 2016, 12:58:51 pm »
She didn't apis, she was very small compared all my other Queens. Thus the thought of going to nucs next season instead of packages. It makes more sense to me.
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Offline apisbees

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Re: New package problem
« Reply #25 on: May 13, 2016, 02:52:13 pm »
It could possibly be a poor queen from the start. The bees should have been able to clean the frames. It is what bees do. I am not to sure that you were given bad advice but maybe a bad queen.
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Offline LazyBkpr

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Re: New package problem
« Reply #26 on: May 13, 2016, 04:46:12 pm »
Agree with apis completely....   A little time and experience, including theis experience, will be beneficial to you in the future. If the queen is not laying after a week I would call who ever I got the package from and get another queen. If they apear to have nosema, I would get another package etc...
   I come down on package bees pretty hard at times, but they DO have their place. I buy packages and let them get started and growing, then replace the queens with local / resistant queens from proven stock. I will often put the package queens in nucs that are well managed to keep them from making drones and see if they will overwinter.
   Often package queens are superseded, and I let the bees replace them, but still replace the queen later when she is laying well... so dont write off packages, just be prepared to deal with the troubles they can cause.
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Offline badgerbeekernube66

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Re: New package problem
« Reply #27 on: May 13, 2016, 05:16:36 pm »
You very well may be right apis, which is why I'd rather buy a nuc that has an established queen from a source I can drive to and observe the operation. My packages come from California, a big bee farm, which I don't trust anymore. The value I will be getting and peace  of mind is well worth the gas money and $32 extra dollars.
Maybe in the future lazy I may buy more package bees, but for now I think I will stick with nucs. What I need is more experience all around, so the opportunity with the keep I spoke of earlier is what I'm going to seek out. I just got another offer from a local with 25 years keeping bees and wants to show their operation. I figure it's best to learn from many. Which is why I like this forum. I read more than I post, but that's because I still know so little!
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Offline riverbee

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Re: New package problem
« Reply #28 on: May 13, 2016, 06:46:21 pm »
thanks badgerbeek!  not sure you had a bad queen, it may have been the frames.............even though bees can and will clean them up......hmmm, they will suffer from whatever is in the frames trying to clean them up. you made a good decision to move these frames out, but does 'cripple' the queen and population. no surprise to me that the population dwindled down.

buying package bees is a crap shoot and so is buying nucs anymore...... but also what we hive them in is our responsibility to keep our bees healthy.  it's a tough call.  was it the queen, the package or the frames you hived them in?  just questions i would ask myself if i were in your bee shoes, and i am sure you have! 

if your old frames (from your description) had nosema, this would certainly 'cripple' ANY package bees and queen.

if the queen was small...... a not very well fed and/or mated queen .............

hard to say........? 

just my thoughts and long distance arm chair thinking.......... ;D

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Offline badgerbeekernube66

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Re: New package problem
« Reply #29 on: May 13, 2016, 07:42:12 pm »
I have considered those things for sure RB!
It seems that bee problems are generally a combination of variables. Live, learn, move on is the motto I live by.
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Offline riverbee

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Re: New package problem
« Reply #30 on: May 13, 2016, 09:51:22 pm »
"It seems that bee problems are generally a combination of variables. Live, learn, move on is the motto I live by."

yes many variables!!! hard to help someone sometimes from a distance with some things, just what we have collectively experienced to offer suggestions.
be so cool to be right there with you or anyone else to go through a hive with those who are learning............but then again, bees still sometimes leave me wondering and mumbling non disney language........ :D

best wishes, keep us posted, sorry about the loss/demise of your one package.......it's not only about the dollars, but the excitement of hiving a package only to see a problem, and lose it for whatever reason.  been there, done that.  hang in there!
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Offline apisbees

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Re: New package problem
« Reply #31 on: May 13, 2016, 11:50:07 pm »
Quote from: riverbee on May 13, 2016, 09:51:22 pm
yes many variables!!! hard to help someone sometimes from a distance with some things, just what we have collectively experienced to offer suggestions.
Just from what you have described being there most likely would not have provided a definitive answer. with more knowledge come the ever increasing list of possible causes. With the dysentery the FB should have controlled it. But regardless of this the queen should have started to lay. Even if it was a diminishing amount of brood or that brood in the hive was dieing.
Toxic Honey? I doubt this as the queen would have been laying and you should have seen it in the brood. and the bees would have been consuming more of the syrup than stored honey.j Although there are plants that produce toxic honey (to the bees) It is extremely rare.

I would send an email off the the supplier with a link to the threads that you started on the forum and ask if any one else has reported similar Issues. and see what they come up with as cause and effect. Keith
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