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Offline DebNoble

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failing nuc
« on: July 12, 2016, 01:48:23 pm »
Hi - I'm a new beekeeper as of May 31st and so I'm in a state of nervous worrying! I have 2 strong colonies. One was so strong it was filling up supers fast, so I decided to split it. The split had a couple of frames of honey and a couple of frames of brood, young larva etc. plus a few well developed capped queen cels so I thought they'd be ok to raise their own queen. I also fed them 1:1 syrup. A few days later I noticed dead bees piling up and the live ones were very docile and lethargic. There were some brown smears on the outside. We also had a few days of cool rainy weather. When the sun finally came out and it warmed up I opened it up to check and there were only a few hundred bees and dead brood and emerging dead bees. There was also a pile of dead bees on the bottom board. The live bees seemed to have sort of splayed wings too. There wasn't a queen either - may have got killed or didn't even hatch. So I'm wondering what happened - did they get sick (dysentry?) so were not able to keep brood warm. If its not healthy I dont really want to recombine with my strong hives. Also I think perhaps some robbing is starting. Is the nuc doomed?
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Offline Jen

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Re: failing nuc
« Reply #1 on: July 12, 2016, 02:23:03 pm »
Kinda sounds like tracheal mites with the splayed wings. But I haven't had to deal with this before so I'm not the expert. But just in case it is, here is a site that might shed some light for you.

http://www.clemson.edu/extension/beekeepers/factsheets/honey_bee_tracheal_mite.html
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Offline Perry

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Re: failing nuc
« Reply #2 on: July 12, 2016, 02:32:21 pm »
Hi Deb:

Is this the split you are talking about? I am wondering if when you did the split there were not enough bees in the split to keep the brood warm and it got chilled. Remember that if you did the split and left things in the same yard, the forager bees (older) would return to the original hive.
I doubt it's tracheal mites, they are almost non existent in NS.
Are your original 2 nucs now in double deeps and are there any honey supers on them?
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Offline Les

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Re: failing nuc
« Reply #3 on: July 12, 2016, 02:34:23 pm »
Does the hive have a bad smell?
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Offline DebNoble

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Re: failing nuc
« Reply #4 on: July 12, 2016, 03:00:43 pm »
Yes Perry this is the split! I put it about 20 ft.  from the original hive faced in a different direction but I'm sure you're right - the foragers took off back home! Then the brood got chilled - including the new queen pupae.
Is that why they were so docile and lethargic? Depressed and queenless?
The original big nuc (i call it #1) has a full deep of brood, then 2 medium supers full of honey (and a little brood) on that deep, than on top of those 3 boxes I have a shallow which is also being filled! So 4 boxes in the stack. Almost too much of a good thing. I haven't fed them in a few weeks either. The other original nuc (#2) is ticking along nicely with a deep full of brood, a medium full of honey and a second medium just started.  I decided to go with mediums since I'm not able to shift full deeps off for inspection (those honey-filled mediums weigh a ton as it is lol).
Anyhow, any ideas on what to do with the little queenless nuc? so did the bees also die from being chilled? They somehow don't/didn't seems very healthy... maybe they're goners?
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Offline DebNoble

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Re: failing nuc
« Reply #5 on: July 12, 2016, 03:05:19 pm »
Thanks for the link Jen!
 There's no bad smell Les...
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Offline Perry

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Re: failing nuc
« Reply #6 on: July 12, 2016, 07:27:52 pm »
If you wanted to, you could just spray them with some 1 to 1 syrup with a few drops of lemongrass oil and just shake them out in front of one of your other hives.
When doing a walk-away split in the same yard, it is always a good idea to shake extra bees in to compensate for foragers returning to the old hive.
You haven't really lost anything, you still have the original 2 colonies, and you have gained some experience, it is how we learn.
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