Rocky Start

[PappyRick]

I'll paraphrase a recent post in this forum that basically said every time you plan an inspection, be prepared for some unexpected event that will change your whole approach.  This is our first foray into this fantastic adventure.

I got my bees on Saturday.  First off, I went out to my proposed site, prepared the site, set and leveled the hives and then contacted my supplier for my 2 nucs.  When we got out to the site to load the nucs, the supplier, who is a beek in the area, said the site I had selected was flood prone, and if we had a big rain, my hives would probably float away.  Opps.  So we relocated the hives further up a hill.  Had to reset the hives and level them on rather unlevel ground.  After some effort, we got "close enough".  I figured a 1/4 bubble on the level was good.

We then prepared to load the nucs.  Unfortunately my wife (who was 20 feet away with full gear on), got popped right on the end of her nose when the veil got pushed back to her face.  (Ah, the value of hats under the veil.)  She handled it like a trooper, and didn't give up on beekeeping yet.

So we got the first nuc loaded.  Found the queen and eggs, brood, pollen and nectar, and got the hive reset.  Loaded a gallon of 1:1 syrup.

When we got to the second nuc, when we took the top cover off of the nuc, the bees came boiling out of the nuc.  LOTS of brood, pollen, nectar, eggs.  We did not find the queen.  The second nuc had a ton of bees, and also had about 6 queen cells.  SO, I am concerned that the colony may be already preparing to swarm.  On the lead of the experienced bee supplier and beekeeper, we destroyed the queen cells and set the nuc frames into the hive in a checkerboard pattern to give the colony more room and hopefully prevent a swarm.  We loaded a gallon of 1:1 syrup. 

Plan is to go back to check on this hive on Tues or Wed to see if they are adapting to the new space or had already decided they were leaving.  Any thoughts or suggestions.  I need to work on posting pics to better illustrate what I'm seeing.  Fact is, when we went out Saturday, the only camera we brought was the cell phone.

[Perry]

As long as the eggs that were in the second nuc are OK I guess it has the ability to requeen itself should some of the bees depart in a swarm. Were those queen cells capped, loaded, or just cups? I am not a huge fan of destroying queen cells, having learned from Iddee that often as not you end up with a queenless hive.

[PappyRick]

Some of the cells appeared to have royal jelly (at least to me), but none were capped.  When we go back out on Tuesday, we'll see if the bees constructed new queen cells.  We may also add another deep to that hive.  We'll have to make a very inexperienced guess on whether or not they need it.  I was planning on this being a very nice, interesting endeavor that provided some zen-like therapy to my retirement years.  Instead, first day out, this isn't exactly zen-like.  BUT it is interesting. 

[Perry]

Some of the cells appeared to have royal jelly (at least to me), but none were capped.  When we go back out on Tuesday, we'll see if the bees constructed new queen cells.  We may also add another deep to that hive.  We'll have to make a very inexperienced guess on whether or not they need it.  I was planning on this being a very nice, interesting endeavor that provided some zen-like therapy to my retirement years.  Instead, first day out, this isn't exactly zen-like.  BUT it is interesting.

WELCOME to the wild and wacky world of beekeeping.

[Jen]

Hi PappyRick    For me, there are times when working a gentle hive, that beekeeping is zen-like. The temperature is perfect, no wind, gentle queen and very happy and content bees, a bee will land on my forearm and groom herself. But on the other side of the fence, when I get into a hive it's more like dementia prevention    in that I have to pay attention, think, and remember. Which in the spring is a task of it's own 

[riverbee]

like perry said, i am one to not cut queen cups or cells, because of the chance of leaving them queenless. if you cut them out, they just rebuild...
did you put them in a single deep? giving them room to grow is a good plan, not sure they will need the 2nd deep right away.  was the nuc a 4 or 5 frame?
and are your other frames foundation or drawn comb?

also, good info in this pdf file:
QUEEN CELL IDENTIFICATION

[Lburou]

I doubt there is a beekeeper who wasn't a bit overwhelmed early in their experience.  I sure was, only to learn that the biggest and loudest bees buzzing my head were drones, and no threat.     

Let's imagine that your first year goes perfectly.  That you feed, add supers, harvest honey and your bees all make it through til next year...Next year will be different, you can count on that.  Keeping bees has a lot of variables that you do not control, chief among them is the weather.

There are some days it is better not to inspect the hives, the bees will tell you by attacking you when you are beginning the inspection.  As a hobbyist, we can afford to wait until the bees are in better humor on another day.

Brace yourself for more anxious moments, and moments of that zen feeling, and commit to a lifelong bee education. 

[Perry]

To add to what Lee said; PappyRick, one day you are going to be out with your hives, the sun will be shining, the girls will be calm, the air smells clear and fresh, birds will be chirping or if you're lucky you can hear a couple of eagles cry out, and you'll just have to stop, take a step back and think to yourself, hey, this is my office! I have one yard that has resident eagles about and they are often flying high overhead, and when I spot them I step back and look around and all I can think of is all the "poor" people sitting in offices somewhere.

[PappyRick]

Thanks folks.  I'm sure you all will be a calming influence in my non-zen-like moments; which I am expecting to be quite often.  I have read as much as my small brain can take in, and know just enough to be dangerous (or maybe only think I know enough to be dangerous).  But, I am willing to observe, take notes (in my little black bee book), and do my best to learn from experience.  I'm one of those seeing is believing fellas, and that's how I commit most things to memory.

RB, the nuc was a 5 frame.  I put them in a single 10 frame deep, and alternated the frames (on the advice of my beekeeper supplier) to try to encourage them to stay put.  My frames had no drawn comb, only foundation.  We will carry a second deep out with us tomorrow just in case.  My hives are about 30 miles away, so I end up with a pickup truck full of stuff when we go out.  I am thinking that I will put the second deep on if they are working the foundation frames heavily.  I gave them a gallon of 1:1 syrup.  I am fully expecting to find new queen cells in this hive tomorrow - or at least evidence that they are developing queen cells. 

Jen, you mentioned calm days and not so calm days.  We had 2 nucs, and the first one was not very happy.  I think we described them as "agitated". 
The second one (and the one I'm more concerned about) was really quite calm.  Since it was the second nuc we loaded, the bees from the first nuc were still buzzing around quite a bit, so it seemed like the second nuc was agitated too.  It was pretty evident, based on the bees on the frames that they were really pretty content.

Comments are appreciated.  I will give an update after we get back out there.  Pappy

[PappyRick]

Oh, one other thing.  We put the entrance reducer in with the small entry.  The way my brain works is I do something and then I end up pondering it for a while and say, "Wait a minute.  I should have done...."  So, should I have left the large entry on the entrance reducer for my more active nuc, or was the small entry OK? :\'(

[Perry]

Looking back, you didn't checkerboard each and every frame did you? With a 5 frame nuc I would not have been inclined to break up each and every frame, but rather have left the middle 3 (if they had brood) together in the middle. If you split up all the brood frames the bees in a 5 frame nuc may have a difficult time covering all that brood.
For a just transferred 5 frame nuc, a 2 to 3 inch entry should be fine for now.

[Green bee]

Some of the cells appeared to have royal jelly (at least to me), but none were capped.  When we go back out on Tuesday, we'll see if the bees constructed new queen cells.  We may also add another deep to that hive.  We'll have to make a very inexperienced guess on whether or not they need it.  I was planning on this being a very nice, interesting endeavor that provided some zen-like therapy to my retirement years.  Instead, first day out, this isn't exactly zen-like.  BUT it is interesting.

  No need to make inexperienced guesses here paparick, your in good hands here. I am also a new beekeeper but like I have herd on this forum a hundred times there isn't much we can mess up the bees can't fix, especially if we ask the right questions to the right people. You may ask ten Beekeepers the same question and get eleven different answers and none of them be wrong. I ask crazy questions all the time just to get my confidence built up. But not one time has anyone on this forum told me it was a stupid question. I enjoy the forum as much as my bees. So remember ask all you want to there's no judging going on here these guys are a great group. Welcome to the world of beekeeping I wish you the best of luck!

[CBT]

Soon you will be sitting in a chair in the late afternoon near your hives with a cold beverage admiring your bees and maybe talking to them. It's ok zen moment.

[Green bee]

Soon you will be sitting in a chair in the late afternoon near your hives with a cold beverage admiring your bees and maybe talking to them. It's ok zen moment.

CBT every time I try that I get stung right above my ear...seems like they love that spot.

[riverbee]

pappyrick, some great posts here, especially lee's comment about a 'lifelong learning experience'.....it's very true.
if we think we know it all.......we don't, there is always something bees teach us.

"RB, the nuc was a 5 frame.  I put them in a single 10 frame deep, and alternated the frames (on the advice of my beekeeper supplier) to try to encourage them to stay put.  My frames had no drawn comb, only foundation.  We will carry a second deep out with us tomorrow just in case.  My hives are about 30 miles away, so I end up with a pickup truck full of stuff when we go out.  I am thinking that I will put the second deep on if they are working the foundation frames heavily.  I gave them a gallon of 1:1 syrup.  I am fully expecting to find new queen cells in this hive tomorrow - or at least evidence that they are developing queen cells."

alright, and i will chime in with what perry said about checkerboarding a 5 frame nuc...............just my HO, do not checkerboard these frames. just transfer what you had into a deep the 5 frames in the center, and your undrawn foundation on the outside. feed, as you are doing. you have 5 frames to be drawn. don't add more space than they need until some of these frames are drawn.

[Perry]

Soon you will be sitting in a chair in the late afternoon near your hives with a cold beverage admiring your bees and maybe talking to them. It's ok zen moment.

CBT every time I try that I get stung right above my ear...seems like they love that spot.

Maybe they're going for the wax? 

[CBT]

Are you a Dapper Dan man? That or something like that might do it. I don't use dandruff shampoo when I'm going to work bees that day and they like me for it.

[PappyRick]

So, as I recall, we did checkerboard most, if not all, of the 5 frames from the nuc into the 10 frame deep.  As I indicated, this was on the advice of the 40 year experienced beekeeper who provided the nuc.  I fully understand Perry's (and others) comments that this may present a coverage problem for the bees to tend the brood.  I'm hopeful that I will be better at understanding what the bees are telling me in the future, and act reasonable accordingly.  Now my question is do I try to undo this when I go back out today, or just leave it alone if it looks like the bees are doing OK with it?

Oh, and one other thing, our schedule is pretty full today, and we were thinking of going out later in the afternoon, early evening.  I know the "preferred" time to inspect was published as 10 to 2 when most of the bees are out foraging.  Is there a particular problem with say a 5 PM inspection (other than more bees)?    Pappy

[Green bee]

Perry there's probably enough in there to draw out a few frames .
 CBT I don't have much hair and that might be the whole problom...that shine on my head in the sunshine