Weak Spring Hive

[Robin]

Hi everyone,

I have one hive and it looks like we have just barely made it through our second winter. We had one of our first warm days of the spring here in Nova Scotia last week and I opened up to see how they were doing. It looks like I am down to only a few hundred bees. They are just finishing up the winter sugar patty I had in with them and I placed half a pollen patty in as it looks (fingers crossed) we are on the upswing in temperatures.

My main question is how do/can I strengthen them? In my poking around I didn't pull the frames with the bees on it to look for the queen, but the frames surrounding them are fairly empty as is the bottom deep. They are hanging out in one of the top corners of the top deep.
2. I have two deeps on right now, should I go to one until the get stronger?
3. From what I have read it is still a bit cool to start syrup but do I have much to lose at this point? Anything to get them to come around.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

Robin

[Bakersdozen]

Hi Robin,  I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but they are probably doomed.  Even if you had a laying queen it doesn't sound like you have enough bees to nurse and provide for any eggs and larvae.  Normally I would suggest combining with another colony, but as you only have the one there isn't much you can do.  Introducing a frame of bees and larvae could be just a prolonging of the inevitable.
If you should have a laying queen, you could drop them down to one brood box.  That will give them a space that is easier to defend.
1:1 sugar syrup given to them inside the hive might be an option.  You would be surprised how low the temperatures can be and the bees will break cluster.  That will simulate a nectar flow.  But again, the queen will not lay any more eggs than the colony can take care of.  In your case, that isn't much.
Keep us posted about the colony.  This may help someone else out in the future.

[riverbee]

robin,
give them feed until you know what's going on, and don't stop until you do....

how old is your queen, if you know?
what 'genetics' of bees/queen are you keeping?
how many frames do you think the bees covered just from opening it up?

stay to two deeps, don't mess with pulling boxes, bees move up in winter months to stores in the top deep, they will not go back down to the bottom deep.  if they are out or close to being out of stores in the top deep,  add sugar bricks, or some type of fondant. don't pull frames until it is warm enough and don't pull frames to look for the queen. if the queen is absent, you will not be able to 'strengthen' them. if she is present, FEED and don't stop feeding. sugar bricks, or sugar supplement thrown in on top of the frames.

at this point you don't know if the queen is missing, so i would feed them and don't stop until you know. sometimes bees can overwinter and come out in smaller clusters! if the queen is gone, you won't be able to strengthen, they will dwindle and die. they made it this far, so i would say feed until you do know.

what are your temps, day? night? sugar syrup is probably not practical for you, if your temps are too cold, the bees cannot utilize this liquid.

let us know, ask questions, keep us posted!

[Perry]

Robin, if you are ever near Wolfville, stop by and I will give you a fondant patty to put in your hive. It is a much better solution right now as our temps are just not there yet to begin feeding syrup. Bees love fondant and it is super easy for them to take.
Try not to mess around too much at this point, I haven't pulled any frames yet except on hives I knew were dead.

[tedh]

Robin, if you are ever near Wolfville, stop by and I will give you a fondant patty to put in your hive. It is a much better solution right now as our temps are just not there yet to begin feeding syrup. Bees love fondant and it is super easy for them to take.
Try not to mess around too much at this point, I haven't pulled any frames yet except on hives I knew were dead.

This is what I love about beekeepers!  If I may:  pay attention newer keeps!  Examples like this and help I've obtained from beekeepers in my area is why I try to bend over backwards to help newer keeps in the area regardless of the cost.  Information is priceless but that "extra mile" is what can really make the difference.  Good on you Perry and thanks!  Ted

[Jen]

Thanks Ted! I couldn't agree more. I understand the need to go out and help other newbees, and other seasoned beeks that may need help. Now that we have a county bee club and a wonderful facebook page, when the newbees come on with questions, or they are shy to admit that their hive didn't make thru the winter, I ask them if they would like for me to come and help them look at their hive. Very satisfying work to be sure 

[Robin]

Thank you for the responses everyone!

You can watch as many youtube videos and read as much as you want but specific advice like this is way more valuable to new keeps like myself. My goal going into the winter was to keep things as much the same as the first winter as they were extremely strong last spring. We did have an unusual winter for our climate but alas I am in this situation.
As for the queens age I believe she is the original that came in my nuc almost 3 years ago.
My plan is to keep the feed going until like Riverbee says, I figure out what's going on. I have a "Pro Winter Patty" and half a pollen patty in there now. Perry, thank you for the fondant offer. If we end up down that way I will take you up on the fondant offer. Any chance I can get your recipe?
From what I can see is that they are staying in the top corner of about three frames where the winter patty is. I have no plan to pull frames out of fear of damaging what is remaining. Just trying to be patient now and hope for a turn around!
I will keep everyone posted but please keep any thoughts on this coming. I found it hard to find any information on what to do in this situation outside of this.

Robin

[Perry]

Hey Robin. I buy my fondant, I'm too big (100 colonies) and too lazy to make my own. It is a purpose made fondant especially for bees. I buy 30 kg boxes and cut them up into smaller patties to fit into my hives. I've used fondant to help light hives get through winter for years with good success.


http://www.ambrosia.eu/en/ambrosia-bee-food-fondant/

[Jen]

Robin "Just trying to be patient now and hope for a turn around!"

And there ya have it folks, Robin has learned the first and best clue to beekeeping...

PATIENTS!

Good Goin' Robin, that is more than half the bee experience 

[riverbee]

"You can watch as many youtube videos and read as much as you want but specific advice like this is way more valuable to new keeps like myself.

As for the queens age I believe she is the original that came in my nuc almost 3 years ago.

My plan is to keep the feed going until like Riverbee says, I figure out what's going on. I have a "Pro Winter Patty" and half a pollen patty in there now.

From what I can see is that they are staying in the top corner of about three frames where the winter patty is. I have no plan to pull frames out of fear of damaging what is remaining. Just trying to be patient now and hope for a turn around!
I will keep everyone posted but please keep any thoughts on this coming. I found it hard to find any information on what to do in this situation outside of this."

robin, you are doing great.
you tube videos can't really answer specific questions like yours. books are great however sometimes we all need input from other beeks who have been there, done that.  this forum is great for that, or if you have a mentor or belong to a bee club, all very helpful for specific questions relative to your situation.  keep asking questions, its why we are here!

your queen, she may not be the original from the nuc you started 3 years ago.

just keep the feed going (keep sugar on, or your winter patty) until you have a chance to look at and assess your queen. the bees are on the feed, because your stores are slim to none in the hive and they are clustering/depending on this feed for survival.  don't let them run out!

[Robin]

For an update, today was the day I checked to see if my colony made it through. Sadly I opened up to find only a few slow moving bees crawling around. I suspected it would be the case as there has been very little activity around the hive this spring.

Initially I thought that they may have ran out of food as we had a vey mild winter here, but on a closer look today there was still at least a frame and a half of honey. To make it worse, the few bees crawling around did not look healthy. They looked as if they were covered in their feces or a tar like substance. As well there is smearing on the top of the frames where the cluster was hanging out and has run down some of frames which leads me to think that they could have failed due to Nosema. I treated with Fumigilin in the fall but remember that they did not go through the entire serving (perhaps I was too late?). I thought with he ventilation I had it may have been enough.
The bottom deep looks very clean with only a bit of honey remaining, but the top had about a frame and a half of honey left. There was random brood throughout the top deep which appears to have been there a while. The pile of dead on the bottom board also looked as if it had been there a while.
So many questions...
If it was nosema is there a way to reuse any of the frames for future hive?
Any thoughts on what it may have been other than Nosema?
No sign of the queen in the dead that are recognizable so am wondering if she was among the first do go? There is no fresh brood or eggs.

I would love to hear some thoughts if not for my education but others that might find themselves in a similar situation in the future. Thanks.