Author Topic: Swarming AGAIN! (Read 9356 times)

Jen · « **on:** March 28, 2014, 03:53:53 pm »

;DI've always walked into my swarms that were already boiling out of the hive and in the air. Is this what a potential swarm looks like in the beginning? lots of bees on the front of the hive?

UPDATE: One Hour Later ~ Swarming AGAIN! More Prepared this time

Swarm Gods are testing all of my learning over the winter

Jen · « **Reply #1 on:** March 28, 2014, 04:20:31 pm »

Okay! They've landed, on the ground this time

I hope I did the right thing by putting a medium with frames, pulled wax and a bit it HBH on each side of the frames. They are still wrestless, so leaving them alone for a bit.

Should I just cut the bees out of the grasses and bushes there? or should I wait to see if they go into the medium?

LazyBkpr · « **Reply #2 on:** March 28, 2014, 04:42:28 pm »

Seriously?
Put the box you have hived them in on the ground, put a piece of plywood or washcloth etc so they can walk into the hive. As long as the queen is in there they will walk in.
This from the new or old hive?

Jen · « **Reply #3 on:** March 28, 2014, 04:54:37 pm »

This is a cast off from the mother hive. The bees seem to have congregated on the bush about 1 foot up from the medium ~

LazyBkpr · « **Reply #4 on:** March 28, 2014, 04:58:00 pm »

ok... you left only ONE extra cell in that hive right???
if you can find that Virgin queen you can pinch her and recombine the bees, unless you want to try to make a go of this one too?

Jen · « **Reply #5 on:** March 28, 2014, 04:59:26 pm »

Left two cells.

I'm not sure yet on what i want to do. Our friend, may want to work with another hive, he has only one right now.

Do I still put the plywood/towel between the cluster and the medium? Will they walk into it completely empty?

apisbees · « **Reply #6 on:** March 28, 2014, 06:44:30 pm »

take a couple of frames and tuck them under the swarm and scoop, brush, shake, smoke the bees onto the frames then put them in the hive with as many bees on them as possible. Then repeat the process until most the bees are in the hive and the bees are fanning to attract the bees into the new colony.

blueblood · « **Reply #7 on:** March 28, 2014, 06:51:51 pm »

Wow, glad you have been able tom capture them both.

apisbees · « **Reply #8 on:** March 28, 2014, 06:56:47 pm »

It is a small cast swarm. this queen will be a virgin and will need to be mated as well as the queen in the hive that swarmed. Don't be giving anything away until you are sure that both are laying queens. then you make a decision on what to do if you have an extra queen. things can happen during the mating process so think of this extra queen is insurance.
Although they don't know it (the bees) they really can't afford to loose these bees from their colony with out effecting it viability in producing a honey crop.
I am thinking 2 queen system, can guild you through it.

Perry · « **Reply #9 on:** March 28, 2014, 07:14:08 pm »

Crazy Californian Bees, and to think there are those that want to import them up here!

Seriously, you got great advice from a couple of sources!

Jen · « **Reply #10 on:** March 28, 2014, 07:39:48 pm »

No Kidding Hu Perry! Geez! This girl has had some serious excercise this last week. But I sure have learned a lot, and it was a true test of my reading this winter along with some great booster advice when the swarms came about... way earlier than I had expected.

I most of the bees down off of the bank, I had to get with it cause it's been raining all day.

I'm hitting the recliner for a bit, I'll check back after while.

Thanks to everyone for here as soon as you could.

Jen · « **Reply #11 on:** March 28, 2014, 10:14:12 pm »

Apis- ""It is a small cast swarm. this queen will be a virgin and will need to be mated as well as the queen in the hive that swarmed. Don't be giving anything away until you are sure that both are laying queens. then you make a decision on what to do if you have an extra queen. things can happen during the mating process so think of this extra queen is insurance.
Although they don't know it (the bees) they really can't afford to loose these bees from their colony with out effecting it viability in producing a honey crop.
I am thinking 2 queen system, can guild you through it.""

I'm glad to be reminded that an extra queen is a good thing.

This swarm is not exactly small, it's smaller than the original swarm last week, maybe a little smaller than a basket ball. Yes I agree that the mother hive now has less than half of her bees now... I think.

I don't know how to determine how many bees make, say, 10,000 bees, would that be the size of a basketball? or......?

What do you mean by a two queen system?

tbonekel · « **Reply #12 on:** March 28, 2014, 11:01:33 pm »

I hope I respond before anyone else, because I want to see if I get it right.

A two queen system would consist of two deeps placed one on top of the other with a queen excluder separating them. Then have one queen in the bottom, and one in top. The worker bees can come and go and everybody is fat and happy.

Did I get it right?

Jen · « **Reply #13 on:** March 28, 2014, 11:09:20 pm »

Hey tbone- if this is the case, I'm trying to imagine the order of the hives. I can visualize a queen on the bottom, bees, excluder. A queen on the top, bees.

K, then, the deep on the top would need an entrance? or all the bees would use the entrance on the bottom?

What if the deep on the top decides they want to grab the queen a swarm.... how will they get the queen on the top out?

scratching head

tbonekel · « **Reply #14 on:** March 28, 2014, 11:25:48 pm »

I better first of all say that I don't want to get in too deep with this because I could be in for, and would deserve a tongue lashing from others giving somewhat incorrect info, but, if they don't have an entrance up top, then they can't swarm. But all that to say, I don't think I'm prepared to do something like that because management for a hive like that would be somewhat tricky for me.

Jen · « **Reply #15 on:** March 28, 2014, 11:28:15 pm »

Thanks Tbone- Mee Neither! We'll see what the others say. Love your dandelion pic, so fresh and inspiring

Woody Roberts · « **Reply #16 on:** March 28, 2014, 11:33:53 pm »

I don't know much about two queen systems. As I've said before I'm a little quick to combine when I think something is wrong.
Last year I had a hive swarm. The only hive I've ever had swarm. I took a couple cells and started a nuc leaving a couple cells in the original hive. The nuc queen got mated and started laying. The parent hive didn't.
I gave them a frame of brood but they didn't build any cells. I combined them with the hive next to them.

This now consisted of three deeps. Bottom with queen and brood. Middle packed solid with honey. Top was the swarm hive.

The swarm hives second deep which was also full of honey I set on another hive.

Iddiee informed me I didn't wait quite long enough. Sure enough a week or so later I checked and the top was full of eggs with the queen on the frame. Queen in the bottom box also. No queen excluder just a deep full of honey.

I separated it and now call it my Idiee hive.

I could be mistaken but I think a two queen system has the queens separated but sharing a storage space.

Jen · « **Reply #17 on:** March 28, 2014, 11:40:02 pm »

Thanks Woody- I just don't know if I'm advanced in my learning enough to try a system like this.

Woody Roberts · « **Reply #18 on:** March 28, 2014, 11:50:07 pm »

I've thought about trying it but for some reason it doesn't really appeal to me. Since you need lots of bees to make surplus honey what I have done is when I pull the old queen and the hive raises a new one. I'll steal brood from the old one and give it to the new one. Their not prone to swarm with a new queen and I can hold the old queen to a single deep all summer.
I've had no trouble overwintering in a single deep here.

The old queen is like a swarm queen. She's in build up mode and I'll have to rob brood from her pretty regular or she will out grow her hive.

LazyBkpr · « **Reply #19 on:** March 29, 2014, 12:25:53 am »

Two queen systems I have helped manage had supers between the brood boxes.. OR, had the brood boxes set side by side, with ten frame supers set in the middle of them, obviously separated with an excluder. The pyramid style two queen system just had Nuc lids on the exposed top of the brood chambers. An upper entrance allowed the bees to get into the supers from the top, as well as coming up through the brood boxes.
The problem we encountered was that the bees tended to choose one queen over the other and we never could get them equalized. This happened in both style systems.. New queens helped a little, but usually by the next spring they were starting to become unbalanced again. One queen out laying the other? Stronger Pheromone? I don't know. It was a limited trial, and I didn't get to fuss with it nearly enough. They were not my bees... I will say, that they DID produce quite a lot of honey. When I get where I want to be I hope to try this myself in a situation I can play with it a little more.