Author Topic: Pre Fall Hive Inspection Mother Hive (Read 6815 times)

Jen · « **on:** October 11, 2014, 09:49:33 pm »

My mother hive never fails to dissapoint me, being with me longer than the other 3 casaulties in 4 years. She is the one who threw out the first swarm this last spring, and from there, 9 more cast swarms resulted from her and the other swarms that were hived, progressing me from 1 hive to 4 hives thru the summer, of which I found I could manage better than I expected,

One month ago, I noticed that the deep was getting very full of bees, plenty of full frame brood. So I put a fresh medium with new frames/foundation hoping for the best. Knowing that that would slow them down to have to pull comb, I figured I would at least get medium frames somewhat pulled for next season.

Here is what I found:

DEEP- No bee room whatsoever, pulled up frames 1, 2, and 6. Frames 2 and 6 heavy with brood, then closed her up way too many loud robbers hovering. I 'assume' the rest of this deep is the same way with brood. Top of these deep frames are covered with bees. There is no more room at the Inn.

MIDDLE MEDIUM- This is the medium that I put on a month ago, it's about 1/4 of the way pulled, that's all it is, is a some pulled wax. I fed so that they would pull. Disappointing. Why didn't the bees get going on the cell building to help the queen for laying?

TOP MEDIUM- There is not enough honey here to last the winter for sure. Only one frame is completely capped both sides. Maybe 5 other frames with capped honey or nectar/syrup in cells. Disappointing.

My thoughts: I was going to kick out the middle medium but then thought that the bees may want to move up and cluster there, which is right under the medium with honey. there is definately enough bees to do that.

How about Feed Feed Feed!

riverbee · « **Reply #1 on:** October 11, 2014, 10:14:29 pm »

how many frames are drawn in the middle medium jen?

my thought is remove the middle medium, and feed as you yourself have been thinking. if they don't have enough stores, consider fondant, candy board, shim for sugar or patties, for alternatives after syrup can no longer be fed.

Gypsi · « **Reply #2 on:** October 11, 2014, 10:17:45 pm »

there is an old technique to get bees to store honey. Pull the queen and the brood move to a different hive box. Leave existing hive in present position. Does depend somewhat on having the right age bees for wax workers, but my most honey productive hive this fall was the queenless wonder, they had 2 boxes capped and uncapped nectar and honey, everyone else much less. Takes stores and bees to feed brood.

Jen · « **Reply #3 on:** October 11, 2014, 10:53:03 pm »

Riv- "how many frames are drawn in the middle medium jen?

MIDDLE MEDIUM- This is the medium that I put on a month ago, it's about 1/4 of the way pulled, that's all it is, is some pulled wax. I fed so that they would pull wax. Disappointing. Why didn't the bees get going on the cell building to help the queen for laying? The deep is so stuffed with bees... scratching head.

Anyway, this is what the middle medium is like. Maybe the center of the medium may has 2-3 frames that are half way fulled. No stores of any kind here.

Gypsi, if the queen is pulled to get the bees to move, at what point do you put the queen back?

riverbee · « **Reply #4 on:** October 11, 2014, 11:07:07 pm »

i would pull it out, empty cells and undrawn frames can be problematic for clustering bees.

why didn't they draw this out? lot's of variables jen, the best time of year for drawing comb really is in the spring and early summer months and/or when there is a prolific flow on. you need lot's of young bees to draw frames. i don't usually put on any foundation much after june in my hives, unless i have a swarm or started a nuc, and then i will give them foundation, later in the season doesn't work so well, flows wax and wain, and sugar syrup isn't always the answer. if a queen stops laying because of a drought.....or there is an interruption in brood rearing of some sort for some reason......hard to say, and difficult to answer your question with certainty.

riverbee · « **Reply #5 on:** October 11, 2014, 11:12:06 pm »

oops, and forgot to mention the importance of pollen jen, bees need both to build up a hive.

Jen · « **Reply #6 on:** October 11, 2014, 11:20:40 pm »

HmmKay, thinking ~ Now, in this deep with so many bees, there is also plenty of nicely capped brood, I would say, guessing, 60-70%. If this deep with no bee space left, after this brood hatches out... where are they going to go? There's no room. I see a swarm coming on.

riverbee · « **Reply #7 on:** October 11, 2014, 11:49:03 pm »

these are your winter bees......
feed them to get them to fill up your top medium for winter stores. i highly doubt they will draw any comb this time of year in that empty medium, so let them fill the drawn medium with winter stores. i also doubt a swarm, but i shouldn't have said that.......

Jen · « **Reply #8 on:** October 12, 2014, 12:10:48 am »

Okay, the winter bees are in the capped brood. They will hatch out, in the meantime some of the live bees in there now will be dying off.

Kick the middle medium out, bring down the top medium and feed until they take no more syrup, helping to ensure they fill more of this medium. And I'm sure I'll have to give them supplement feeding over the winter. I like winter patties.

You have been a great help as usual Riv, thanks bunches

riverbee · « **Reply #9 on:** October 12, 2014, 12:36:22 am »

jen, you got it sistah!

Gypsi · « **Reply #10 on:** October 12, 2014, 01:34:58 am »

the queen is generally pulled during a heavy nectar flow for about 3 weeks. If there is a strong enough flow the bees do not always develop laying worker syndrome. (no guarantees on this but mine didn't) Of course mine then decided not to accept a new queen too, so, no guarantees on anything. It is a technique, a tool. I think it is the wrong time of year to use it, just pull the medium and feed them up and I make fondant with pollen sub in it for my bees in winter, usually about 2 half batches (don't have a pan big enough for the full batch)

Jen · « **Reply #11 on:** October 12, 2014, 12:41:34 pm »

Yup, that's my plan to pull the middle medium. I have a bee friend in Denmark that makes his fondant with stinging nettle tea in place of just water. He says that the nutrition in the nettle tea is very good for the bees and it has natural gut medicine in it to keep the bees gut healthy, a natural antibiotic. I'm intrigued with this idea.

Gypsi, do you use fumigilin?

Gypsi · « **Reply #12 on:** October 12, 2014, 01:27:53 pm »

No Jen, I don't

I don't use anything much but powdered sugar to dust for mites, manual removal of drone comb for mites and a screened bottom board with a sticky for mite county. I gather that nosema likes cold damp weather, and since I started beekeeping in the first year of the drought, I have never seen nosema. If I don't see the disease, I don't treat for it. I know the symptoms, and they just aren't here.

lazy shooter · « **Reply #13 on:** October 12, 2014, 01:30:26 pm »

How do you make stinging nettle tea? Is your stinging nettle a low growing vine like plant? It's a curious mind thing.

Gypsi · « **Reply #14 on:** October 12, 2014, 01:35:02 pm »

http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=stinging+nettle&id=C5C767850DF7F0EDF148BE32850C7E9709EB84E9&FORM=IARRTH

I don't think it grows here Lazy Shooter

Jen · « **Reply #15 on:** October 12, 2014, 01:51:19 pm »

Here ya go Lazy, I don't harvest the plant myself, you can buy it in the tea bag form just like black tea or chamomile tea. Or, you can buy it in bulk. I buy it thru Amazon, 1 pound for about 15-20 bucks, a pound is about the size of a basket ball. I drink a cup every day thru the winter for aches, immune support, among other possitive gains. It's really good stuff.

Stinging Nettle
Nettle leaves are a powerful herbal medicine that grow abundantly in the wild. They are rich in chlorophyll and minerals such as iron, chromium, zinc, copper, magnesium, silicon, cobalt, and calcium. Nettles are also high in vitamins A, E, D, C, & K. Nettle tea is a strong immune booster and has the ability to neutralize toxic antigens in the body. Nettles also contain a potent anti-inflammatory agent which help to curb the action of cytokines, one of the key components to inflammation in the body. Nettle leaves are also very helpful in preventing chronic headaches, sore throats, sinus infections, and fatigue and are beneficial for diabetics as it is known to lower blood sugar levels. Nettles are known to help relieve bronchial ailments such as chronic coughing, chest congestion, COPD, and TB. Nettles are also powerful enough to help eliminate viral and bacterial infections and aid in removing excess fluids in the body by acting as a natural diuretic. Nettle leaf can provide relief for digestive issues such as nausea, flatulence, acid reflux, and colitis. Nettle tea supports the endocrine system including the spleen, thyroid, and pancreas. It is also beneficial in boosting liver and heart health and helps to prevent urinary tract infections as well as bladder and kidney stones. Nettle tea can also help stop frequent nighttime urination, which may be beneficial for those who need to sleep soundly without interruption. As a mouth rinse, cooled nettle tea is excellent for gingivitis and can help prevent plaque buildup on the teeth. Fresh wild nettle can be found growing as weeds in garden beds, in empty lots, and meadows & fields and can be juiced, steeped as a tea, or steamed like spinach. Dried nettles leaves can be found online or at your local health food store and be used as a tea for daily benefits. Capsules & tinctures are also available and provide another way to get the amazing health benefits of this healing herb year-round.

Jen · « **Reply #16 on:** October 12, 2014, 01:56:40 pm »

Gypsi- "If I don't see the disease, I don't treat for it. I know the symptoms, and they just aren't here.

I like to go by this method as well. But last spring, when I had one hive, I did notice some long wet poops on the outside of the hive. So the curiousity of taking precaution.

I have also thought of just treating if I see the problem. But how do you know if there is a problem whithin the hive if it's 7 degrees below, and you don't dare lift the lid. Still working this idea

Gypsi · « **Reply #17 on:** October 12, 2014, 01:59:26 pm »

7 degrees below doesn't happen in Texas. When it is 7 degrees above we think it is 40 degrees below.

Climate. Beekeeping is local

Gypsi · « **Reply #18 on:** October 12, 2014, 02:01:38 pm »

wonder if stinging nettle tea would help my achey feet? except for a heel spur which I have to stretch tendons for, there isn't much wrong with them except I don't sit down a lot.

Jen · « **Reply #19 on:** October 12, 2014, 02:03:39 pm »

I was hoping for a more mild winter here this season, but it's predicted to be long and cold. Didn't get enough summer due to so much smoke shielding the sun. But on the upswing, I'll have plenty of time to finish painting my hallway which got put off this spring due to much swarming.