Author Topic: Robbing prevention question  (Read 7295 times)

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Offline tedh

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Robbing prevention question
« on: January 18, 2015, 10:52:46 am »
Hi Everyone,
Looking ahead, since it's winter and not much more can be done, I'm wondering about robbing and hopefully preventing it.

Some background info:  Josh and I have one hive each made up of two deeps.  We weren't too concerned with robbing in 2014 as Josh had a hive at his house and I had one hive at my house, approx. 7to10 miles apart.  Also, I think "they've" been quite successful in killing off the feral colonies.  Yes, that last statement was said with the utmost sarcasm.  Having the hives at our homes enabled us to watch them several times a day thus allowing us the opportunity to stop any robbing attempts.

The expected changes for 2015: We hope to increase our hive count to 10 this year.  For several reasons we will be utilizing two outyards.  One of the outyards will be about midway between Josh's house and my own.  In this outyard we hope to start four packages.  The other will be about 30 minutes from here and we hope to put the 2 overwintered hives there.  We would then have two hives each at our respective homes.

The concern:  We expect to feed the packages as necessary, every few days (or so), and inspect the two further hives each week (or so).  Since we won't be seeing all the hives each day we're concerned that we wouldn't see the "act" of robbing, only it's "results".  So, we thought we'd put robbing screens on early and just leave them on.  But, if we do that, will it be a hindrance to the bees as far as bringing resources into the hive and removing detritus (dead bees etc) from the hive?  Would the potential stopping of robbing outweigh the potential problem of a hindrance? Granted, Ive had a LOT of time to think about this, so over thinking it is a DEFINITE possibility.  Thanks, Ted 
 
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Offline Lburou

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Re: Robbing prevention question
« Reply #1 on: January 18, 2015, 11:26:41 am »
Leaving a robbing screen on all the time would be fine if it is similar to the design of the screen Iddee shared some time ago.  His screen has an open top side.  Interested why you decided on two outyards....   :)

Lee_Burough

Offline tefer2

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Re: Robbing prevention question
« Reply #2 on: January 18, 2015, 11:35:16 am »
I think your method of feeding has something to do with your decision.
Feeding inside the hives rather than exposed feeders helps a bunch.
You won't know that your outyards are being emptied cause your not there everyday watching.
So, robber screens on your hives away from home are a must.
After they get built up they are more able to defend attack.
We prefer iddee's version for a simple robber screen up here.

http://www.worldwidebeekeeping.com/forum/index.php/topic,1420.msg19070.html#msg19070

Offline brooksbeefarm

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Re: Robbing prevention question
« Reply #3 on: January 18, 2015, 12:16:35 pm »
I have several outyards, some 30 min. away and some 1 hour away. I don't worry about robbing until the flow is over usually in my area July & Aug., i then check my hives for strength, the strong hives i don't worry about,they are usually the ones doing the robbing. The weaker hives i put intranche reducers on and take note of why i think they are weak,which in most cases i replace the queen. Putting and leaving a robbing screen on would deter robbing,(and i think reduce storage) but i would only leave it on until (or if) the hive builds up enough to defend it's self or requeen it. It's like the cattle business, you can run a good cow where you have a bad one. 8) Jack

Offline tefer2

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Re: Robbing prevention question
« Reply #4 on: January 18, 2015, 12:30:00 pm »
I think you can get away with leaving iddee's robber screen on all season.
The top of it is open along the total width of the hive. Plenty of space to avoid traffic jams.
We always remove the entrance reducer completely when installing them too.
Like Brooks, they go on after we pull supers in August.
Just before the robbers, yellowjackets, and Baldfaced hornets arrive.   :o :o

Offline tedh

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Re: Robbing prevention question
« Reply #5 on: January 18, 2015, 06:30:49 pm »
Please forgive my straying from the topic.  I just wanted to say that I reserve Friday mornings to spend with my father and Sundays to spend with my good friend (and mother-in-law).  I had a wonderful day today, but I was also made aware that our "people" are all getting old.  Part of me finds this...depressing?  However on the other hand I realize how lucky we are to have "people" in our lives who have lived long enough to become old.  I'm very grateful for this.  Again my apologies for straying.

I do plan on making iddee's robbing screens...with Lazy's help...hehehe!  We've decided to use the outyards as we live in an area that is made up, for the most part, of monoculture deserts.  The only real forage for bees will be found in the roadside ditches, grass waterways, and the timber along streams, etc..  The furthest yard is a test for us this year.  We  think it'll have the most forage and most diversity of forage for the bees.  It's comprised of about 500 acres of land in set aside programs, with lots of timber and all of the wild flowers associated with those areas.  Our thought is that while we will feed if necessary, and put sugar blocks on for insurance over the winter, we'd rather not have to maintain feeders all summer long.  I know, but that's what we'd like.  We think this particular area will give us and the bees the best chance of having that happen.  We think that if it's not possible there we probably shouldn't keep bees.  Though, I'm sure we will!  Being truthful I'll also add that seeing how many bees were in our yard this past fall with only ONE hive I can only imagine how it'd be with 5 or 6 hives!  No, the bees weren't aggressive...but MAN were they inquisitive!  You couldn't be in the yard without 3 or 4 bees flying around your face... always.  I know I know!  But that's how it is.
  We do, and I should have mentioned earlier, feed in enclosed feeders.  Four jar feeders in and empty box with the tele cover on top.  As far as being okay as long as the flow is on?  Yeah, if I could only tell.  I can see when pollen comes in but nectar?  Not so much.  I'm hoping with more experience this will change, but until then....  That also ties into strong vs. weak hives.  This past year with only two hives all I could say at any one time was that one hive was stronger than the other.  Does that mean I had one strong hive and one weak hive?  Or, two weak hives with one of them stronger than the other?  Or, two strong hives with one of them weaker?  Or...well, I'm sure you get the point.
  Anyway, It sounds as though most think it would be okay to leave them on all season?  By the way, I asked Lazy about this and he said I should try it and see.  Good advise I'm sure, however I WAS hoping someone else had "experimented" with it and could give me a definitive answer!  hehehe!  Thanks Everyone, Ted
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Offline kebee

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Re: Robbing prevention question
« Reply #6 on: January 18, 2015, 07:02:46 pm »
 I put them on at the last of August and leave them on until the flow starts in the spring, had to for they are the robbing bees I have ever had.

Ken

Offline Jen

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Re: Robbing prevention question
« Reply #7 on: January 18, 2015, 07:38:34 pm »
Ted- "Having the hives at our homes enabled us to watch them several times a day thus allowing us the opportunity to stop any robbing attempts.

    My hives are in my backyard as well Ted, I get accused of over-mothering them. But, I have to say, that for beginner beeks, it's so opportunistic to learn soo much when the hives are in our yards. On the days that I'm home, I love to stand at the door and watch them. I have been able to fend off robbing. And I was present with all 10 swarms early last spring and was able to catch them all except one that did not land but flew away, absconded.

During that swarming I learned soo much soo fast! And the forum here was right at my side guiding me thru it all. I'm so grateful.

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Re: Robbing prevention question
« Reply #8 on: January 19, 2015, 12:18:15 am »
I leave my entrance reducer at 2 bees year round unless the hive is really big and strong

Offline tefer2

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Re: Robbing prevention question
« Reply #9 on: January 19, 2015, 08:00:37 am »
I have placed robber screens on outyards and left them on all season.
Worked out fine for us.
It takes a whole day for the bees to figure out the new entrance location.
Put them on and come back after all the confusion is over.
If your there watching, you will feel inclined to remove it to help them out. Stay away!
Try to add them at dark or very early morning. You just don't want to trap any robbers inside the hive.
The robbers will know the way back in
Another good use is to place them on a hive after moving it.
Great tool to help them orientate to a new location.
Now, you guys get to building a hand full. You'll be glad you have them,


Offline LazyBkpr

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Re: Robbing prevention question
« Reply #10 on: January 19, 2015, 09:18:47 am »
I have placed robber screens on outyards and left them on all season.
Worked out fine for us.
It takes a whole day for the bees to figure out the new entrance location.
Put them on and come back after all the confusion is over.
If your there watching, you will feel inclined to remove it to help them out. Stay away!
Try to add them at dark or very early morning. You just don't want to trap any robbers inside the hive.
The robbers will know the way back in
Another good use is to place them on a hive after moving it.
Great tool to help them orientate to a new location.
Now, you guys get to building a hand full. You'll be glad you have them,

   Well said!!
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Offline Curtchann

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Re: Robbing prevention question
« Reply #11 on: January 19, 2015, 02:56:13 pm »
Will have to file this away for future use!
I have placed robber screens on outyards and left them on all season.
Worked out fine for us.
It takes a whole day for the bees to figure out the new entrance location.
Put them on and come back after all the confusion is over.
If your there watching, you will feel inclined to remove it to help them out. Stay away!
Try to add them at dark or very early morning. You just don't want to trap any robbers inside the hive.
The robbers will know the way back in
Another good use is to place them on a hive after moving it.
Great tool to help them orientate to a new location.
Now, you guys get to building a hand full. You'll be glad you have them,

 

Gypsi

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Re: Robbing prevention question
« Reply #12 on: January 19, 2015, 03:29:07 pm »
so if you are trying to prevent robbing do you also add a top entrance?  Robbers are my number one reason for NOT having any, since we have constant drought and almost constant dearth in my area.

Offline tedh

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Re: Robbing prevention question
« Reply #13 on: January 19, 2015, 05:27:31 pm »
I do use a top entrance.  The entrance on the new reversible covers are only an inch+-.  I'm hoping that will be small enough to guard but I'll let you know.

Made up 15 of the iddee robber screens today.  Ted
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Re: Robbing prevention question
« Reply #14 on: January 19, 2015, 05:32:42 pm »
Do you use a top entrance PLUS a bottom entrance?  Or just a top entrance?

Offline kebee

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Re: Robbing prevention question
« Reply #15 on: January 19, 2015, 06:55:35 pm »
 I close mine off by pulling the top cover up hard against the open, for they try real hard to get in that way also, than when flow starts I open it back up for them.

Ken

Gypsi

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Re: Robbing prevention question
« Reply #16 on: January 19, 2015, 08:16:30 pm »
My robbing is so nonstop I won't risk a top opening and if I did I would put rolled up window screen in it so nothing could get through but air

Offline LazyBkpr

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Re: Robbing prevention question
« Reply #17 on: January 19, 2015, 08:21:35 pm »
Robbing isnt that bad here unless there is no flow. On a decent spring we can have entrances wide open and nucs side by side with hives... but when that flow begins to taper off, it can get really bad in a big hurry..
   Yep, Ted made some of the Iddee Robbing screens...   A FINE job I must admit!
   His top entrance is about 1 x 3/8    Lower entrance is 3/8 by 3" and in mid summer he pulls the reducers so the entrance is OPEN...   depending of course on robbing as summer progresses..
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Offline tefer2

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Re: Robbing prevention question
« Reply #18 on: January 21, 2015, 07:48:58 am »
After the flow is over, all hades breaks loose here.
On years when the yellow jackets are thick, I fold a piece of #8 hardware cloth and close off the upper entrance hole.
Then, it's time to have some fun with the badminton racket. LOL


Offline tefer2

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Re: Robbing prevention question
« Reply #19 on: January 21, 2015, 08:03:36 am »
Here's an idea for all of you that run that 2 inch feeder shim in winter,
Placing the shim above the inner cover makes a space to store those robber screens when not in use.
Help keeps everything for that hive at hand.
Kind of like the attic in your house.
The bees patrol it but don't build comb up there.