Oxalic Acid Discussion

[Slowmodem]

I found this, but I can't find the language in the federal register itself:

http://wasba.org/oxalic-acid-registration-comments-wanted-by-epa/

[efmesch]

I  found this link:
http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/FR-2015-02-04/pdf/2015-02209.pdf.

look at item 5, on the bottom of the first column of page 6086.

If I understand the legalese gobblydygook language, It's the USDA that is requesting the approval of Oxalic Acid for use against varroa.

[LazyBkpr]

Thats it Ef!!!

    6086
Federal Register
/ Vol. 80, No. 23 / Wednesday, February 4, 2015 / Notices
currently registered pesticide products.
Pursuant to the provisions of FIFRA
section 3(c)(4) (7 U.S.C. 136a(c)(4)), EPA
is hereby providing notice of receipt and
opportunity to comment on these
applications. Notice of receipt of these
applications does not imply a decision
by the Agency on these applications.
1. File Symbol: 70051–RRI. Docket ID
number: EPA–HQ–OPP–2015–0007.
Applicant: Certis USA L.L.C., 9145
Guilford Rd., Suite 175, Columbia, MD
21046. Product name: BmJ TGAI. Active
ingredient: Fungicide and
Bacillus
mycoides
isolate J at 100%. Proposed
classification/Use: Manufacturing use.
Contact: BPPD.
2. File Symbol: 70051–RRO. Docket
ID number: EPA–HQ–OPP–2015–0007.
Applicant: Certis USA L.L.C., 9145
Guilford Rd., Suite 175, Columbia, MD
21046. Product name: BmJ WG. Active
ingredient: Fungicide that also claims to
reduce plant viral infections and
Bacillus mycoides
isolate J at 40.0%.
Proposed classification/Use: Almonds,
citrus, cole crops, cucurbits, fruiting
vegetables, grapes, legumes, lettuce,
pecans, pome fruits, potatoes, spinach,
and sugarbeets. Contact: BPPD.
3. File Symbol: 88031–EE. Docket ID
number: EPA–HQ–OPP–2015–0023.
Applicant: CP Bio, Inc., 4802 Murrieta
St., Chino, CA 91710. Product name:
Choline Chloride Technical. Active
ingredient: Biochemical Plant Growth
Regulator and Choline Chloride (Acetyl
Choline) at 98%. Proposed
classification/Use: Manufacturing Use
Product to be Formulated into Plant
Growth Regulator End Use Products.
Contact: BPPD.
4. File Symbol: 88031–EG. Docket ID
number: EPA–HQ–OPP–2015–0023.
Applicant: CP Bio, Inc., 4802 Murrieta
St., Chino, CA 91710. Product name:
Choline Chloride 20% SP. Active
ingredient: Biochemical Plant Growth
Regulator and Choline Chloride (Acetyl
Choline) at 20%. Proposed
classification/Use: Plant Growth
Regulator for Amelioration of Growth
Reduction Caused by Sodic Soils.
Contact: BPPD.
5. File Symbol: 91266–R. Docket ID
number: EPA–HQ–OPP–2015–0043.
Applicant: United States Department of
Agriculture, 10300 Baltimore Ave., Bld.
306 BARC–EAST, Beltsville, Maryland
20705. Product name: Oxalic Acid
Dihydrate. Active ingredient: Oxalic
Acid Dihydrate at 100%. Proposed
classification/Use: Insecticide/in-hive
use to control Varroa mites.

  yes, it is the USDA that has filed for approval, so all of the nasty expenses associated with that approval are waived..
     "as I understand it"      I cant even begin to read some of that stuff without getting a headache..

[efmesch]

Most important in my opinion is the bottom line: the EPA has approved the use of Oxalic Acid in bee hives for the control of Varroa mites.  Any one who wants to read a selection of the many reports on this approval can "Google" under EPA Oxalic Acid Varroa
It may have taken a while, even too long a while, but the approval is there. 

Now the question is:  "How will this affect the price of OA which was relatively cheap until now?"

[iddee]

From The Brushy mountain web site:

We have mentioned that Oxalic Acid has been approved by the EPA; however for it to be used legally it must be registered in the individual states and have the appropriate label. It has been a process but we are working to have all states approved.

Currently North Caroloina and Pennsylvania are registered and it is available at both location. We are continuing to work with other states and expect several to be approved in the coming weeks. Later than we wanted. We will keep the information updated on our website to know where it can be sold.

[LazyBkpr]

Several more states are now approved. Brushy mountain has them listed, and will add the states as they approve the use of Oxalic Acid;

http://www.brushymountainbeefarm.com/Oxalic-Acid/productinfo/727/

[efmesch]

I removed my honey from four of my seven hives and want to start with the oxalic acid treatment on those four.
Unfortunately, we've been suffering through a real "Texas sized" heat wave for the past few days (over 37^o C, over 100^o F).  I'm waitng for the temp to drop to a steady below 25⁰C, 77^oF) to give my first treatment.  It looks like that won't be till late next week.

[Ray4852]

What’s so special about brushymountain oxalic acid? I can buy it on ebay for less. 5lbs for 15 dollars. Bee clubs could buy a 50lb bag for 50 dollars and divided it up equally among its members who want to use it. 35 grm for 5.50 is a lot of money for the same stuff you can buy on ebay or amazon.

[LazyBkpr]

Just one of the stipulations.. it has to be "approved" Oxalic to use in beehives...
   Who has the rights to approve it? What criteria must it meet to be approved?
   I can only assume it is just a good quality OA...
   I am thinking if we start filling baggies and stick labels on them that say Approved for use in beehives  we can sell a bunch of it...   I am sure we can get a consensus of votes that say we all approve right?   

[Ray4852]

my acid is 99 percent pure oxalic acid, I cant get it any better.

[dave]

I know this is a dumb question for many, but before I buy a battery charger....how do you hook up the battery cables from the charger to the battery cables of the vaporizer.  Do you just connect the red to red and black to black or is there a different method.

[Ray4852]

Hook up the black clip to the negative side of battery and red to positive side. Most batteries will have a red cap on the positive side with a plus mark on battery.

[Bakersdozen]

Does anyone here apply OA with the dribble method?  I would like to try it, but I am not messing with a car battery, etc.  I haven't done any mite checks yet, but I have some second year colonies that are likely candidates for treatment.

[LazyBkpr]

   A battery will do a Hive or three, it works better to leave the battery in the truck and hook it up that way, truck idling. I actually use a good set of jumper cables to make the leads longer.
   Yes, red wire to red wire..  though on most vaporizers I do not think it matters which way they are hooked?  Read the instructions before taking my word for it...   I do know that some "idiot" hooked MY varox vaporizer up backwards, and didnt realize it until he was finished treating hives..  still works fine....
   Dribble method...

   Heinz Kaemmerer of Heilyser Technology says:

“You can treat your colonies with a liquid mixture of OA and sugar but be careful. The liquid acid shortens the life of the bees. There is no problem during summer because the bee’s life not longer than approximately 6 weeks. The problem starts with winter bees–do not treat your winter bees more than one time with liquid OA. When using liquid OA bees get wet and have to clean each other. The result is, the acid ends up in their stomach and during winter without a cleaning flight it shortens the life of the bees. Two treatments on winter bees might kill the colony. Liquid OA is a slow killer and bees will probably die after a few weeks or month instead reaching the next season.”

   I stick with the vapor.. dont like cutting so many lives short!   

[Ray4852]

I use a deep cycle marine battery. I probably could treat 30 hives with this battery before I lose 50 percent charge. If you use your vehicle, Try not to make a mistake hooking up your battery connections because you could damage your vaporizer and do damage to the electronics in your vehicle. The varrox has  polarity protection. I don’t know if the other vaporizers do. You can protect your vaporizer by putting in an inline fuse in the positive side to protect it. If you make a mistake the fuse will blow. Anybody can hook up a battery the wrong way. I have done it already. Protect your eyes by warring safety glasses. A battery can leak hydrogen gas. If you hook up wrong. The batter could explode in your face by the strong arc across the terminals.

[Lburou]

Since we are talking about power sources for your oxalic acid vaporizer, I'll offer my two cents.  I use one of THESE 12V power supplies.  It will vaporize two grams of OA in less than two minutes.  My friends say they recharged it after about ten treatments...Just plug it in for a couple hours and you are good to go!



On sale now for $40.  It is also a multitasker in the garage. I got the 12V adaptor from Radio Shack and use it with a 15 AMP fuse.

HTH  :-)

P.S. While I'm treatment free at heart (using VSH queens), I do treat swarms of unknown origin, cut-out bees and any colony I have that has more than 3% on a mite count.  Sometimes I'll use hopguard instead.

[efmesch]

..... before I buy a battery charger....how do you hook up the battery cables from the charger to the battery cables of the vaporizer.  Do you just connect the red to red and black to black or is there a different method.

Red, by agreement, stands for the positive terminal, black for the negative.  In most electrical applications the polarity is important---however, the Oxalic Acid vaporizers are an exception.  Either way you connect the contacts, they produce the heat needed for vaporization (no motor nor fancy electronics are involved here that would be affected by the "direction" of the current).  This explains why Lazybkprs vaporizer still works, in spite of supposedly being connected "incorrrectly". 
The instructions that came with my  vaporizer, (which comes with red and black marked terminals), still specifically states that the direction of the connections is totally unimportant.

[jb63]

Last spring I vaporized O.A., but didn't treat in the fall.I had good honey production but bad winter loss.This year I didn't treat in the spring and it's a bad honey year but I'm going to vape. them in the fall.Maybe October. 

[apisbees]

The issue I have with waiting till Oct to do the fall treatment is that the mites will have been feeding on the fall bees that have hatched. leaving the bees with weakened immune systems and viruses. The most important thing I have learned in keeping bees with the mite is to have the healthiest bees that you can going into winter. This means treating the hives between the 15th  to 20th of August before the brood that will emerge starting at the first of September has been caped over with mites inside feeding on the winter bee larva.

[Bakersdozen]

Since we are talking about power sources for your oxalic acid vaporizer, I'll offer my two cents.  I use one of THESE 12V power supplies.  It will vaporize two grams of OA in less than two minutes.  My friends say they recharged it after about ten treatments...Just plug it in for a couple hours and you are good to go!



On sale now for $40.  It is also a multitasker in the garage. I got the 12V adaptor from Radio Shack and use it with a 15 AMP fuse.

HTH  :-)

P.S. While I'm treatment free at heart (using VSH queens), I do treat swarms of unknown origin, cut-out bees and any colony I have that has more than 3% on a mite count.  Sometimes I'll use hopguard instead.

OK Lee.  I took the plunge and headed over to the new Harbor Freight in my neighborhood.  I bought the jump start power supply you posted.  I am going to give this a try.  Now, to get the rest of the equipment and I will be ready for fall mite treatments.
Last week I bought a power washer from Harbor Freight and it works like a charm.